orthonormal comments on Dreams with Damaged Priors - Less Wrong

36 Post author: Eliezer_Yudkowsky 08 August 2009 10:31PM

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Comment author: SilasBarta 09 August 2009 03:38:45AM 0 points [-]

I think you're doing what Eliezer_Yudkowsky just warned against: how long is that hypothesis?

"The brain 'decides' to erase dream memories in such a way that we lose ~80% of our short-term memory of them and all of the long-term memory of them that we don't deliberately try to remember, on the basis of sufficient Bayes-structure in the brain, and its having observed (over period _?) the lack of entanglement between dream-based conclusions and the real world, and its prediction of sufficiently bad consequences ..."

Also, isn't that brain architecture a pretty narrow target for such a dumb process as evolution to hit? It's smart enough to exterminate dream conclusions (not to mention identify what is a dream, before you wake up) with extreme prejudice but not e.g. astrology?

FWIW, here's the theory I prefer and would defend:

"Dreams are random neuron firings" + "The feeling of dream coherency is the result of the brain's normal procedure for mapping sense data to best hypothesis."

Comment author: orthonormal 09 August 2009 05:37:39PM *  4 points [-]

That is indeed complicated, but that hypothesis isn't what Yvain was suggesting. The proposed adaptation is just that memories don't get stored as usual during REM sleep, which is a relatively simple thing for the brain to do. (Also, it's pretty clear that this actually happens.) It's then argued that this is a good adaptation for evolutionary reasons, because if we lacked it (and kept the rest of our tendencies of believing every conclusion we remember, context notwithstanding) we'd have some problems.

(E.g. an ex-girlfriend of mine who would stay angry at people who had been mean to her in her dreams, despite knowing that it had just been a dream.)

Comment author: NancyLebovitz 02 December 2012 05:29:25PM 3 points [-]

(E.g. an ex-girlfriend of mine who would stay angry at people who had been mean to her in her dreams, despite knowing that it had just been a dream.)

I don't have that bad a case, but sometimes I notice an emotions from a dream continuing into the next day. I drop them when I realize they're from a dream-- but now I realize that I only do that when something reminds me of some detail from the dream and I understand the source of the emotion. Scary thought-- how much of my emotional life is literally dream-based?

Comment author: gwern 02 December 2012 07:37:53PM 1 point [-]

I've noticed sometimes that I think I've done something or I have something, but it was only in a dream. I worry that this will one day affect something important, rather than like last week my plan to have grilled cheese for lunch (I had already eaten all my cheddar cheese).

Comment author: wedrifid 28 August 2009 07:15:17PM 0 points [-]

(E.g. an ex-girlfriend of mine who would stay angry at people who had been mean to her in her dreams, despite knowing that it had just been a dream.)

So Ben Folds wasn't exaggerating?