Peterdjones comments on ESR's New Take on Qualia - Less Wrong

3 Post author: billswift 21 August 2009 09:26AM

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Comment author: UnholySmoke 24 August 2009 12:55:26PM 1 point [-]

A “quale” (singular form) is a brain state with the following properties: (a) like the abnormal activation of a colorblind synesthete’s color pathways in the occipital lobe, or like the first-ever feeling of sexual desire, it is in principle an objectively measurable event with detectable correlates in brain and body, and (b) it’s incommunicable.

Ahh, I was fully on board until the 'incommunicable'. Not even sure what it means to say something's uncommunicable by definition, except that it seems to introduce a brand new element of mystery. Is the 'quale', then, the element of the redness that doesn't go across when I tell the other person about the letterbox? Sounds like putting a name on 'the stuff we don't fully understand yet' - not helpful.

To be honest though, it's not a particularly interesting question. We are physics. All we're doing is shedding light on the particular oddities that arise from experiencing the brain from the inside - there are no deep insights here for me.

Comment author: Peterdjones 21 January 2013 06:16:08PM 0 points [-]

Sounds like putting a name on 'the stuff we don't fully understand yet' - not helpful.

Helpful. We need to put labels on Stuff We Don't Understand yet so that we know what we are talking about when we try t understand it.

Comment author: UnholySmoke 12 April 2013 03:25:57PM 1 point [-]

Peter,

As a general strategy for considering a black box, great. As a vehicle for defining a mysterious 'something' you want to understand, potentially useful but dangerous. Labelling can make a job harder in cases where the 'thing' isn't a thing at all but a result of your confusion. 'Free will' is a good example. It's like naming an animal you plan to eat: makes it harder to kill.

Ben

Comment author: Peterdjones 12 April 2013 03:41:27PM 0 points [-]

But we don't know that qualia aren;t anything and we don't know that about free will either.