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RichardKennaway comments on Let them eat cake: Interpersonal Problems vs Tasks - Less Wrong
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I don't know what else "the quality of this site" could refer to. And now you're saying it's the size, though I don't see how that changes the per-individual probability of being dangerous. Collectively, my impression is that larger communities are safer, because there's room to avoid the few nasty individuals.
Well now. Both of these imaginary characters believe that women owe them sex. The first is being blatant about it, so at least women know in advance to avoid him. The second, that you think "more accurate, for this tiny corner of cyberspace" is the dangerous one. And you think of him as "misunderstood". I think of him as "wrong". As in, believing false things, things that are the opposite of true. And dangerously wrong.
If that type is indeed "more accurate, for this tiny corner of cyberspace", no wonder there are so few women in it.
Please note that nobody on this site has actually stated that men are owed sex from women as a group. As with any such dispute as to who is ethically owed what, this would clearly be a cause of conflict; and we're trying to avoid having such "mind-killer" discussions on Less Wrong.
It was Alicorn who made the leap (see this post), which is evidence that this meme is floating around in mainstream culture. What people were saying is that men with romantic aspirations should be empathized with, given the difficulties they may face.
Is this a "dangerously wrong" notion? Why aren't you objecting to mainstream culture, where the kinds of implied obligations and entitlements Alicorn refers to seem to be widespread?
Well, that wouldn't be a meaningful statement. Under the usual meanings of owing, someone has got to pay up. But women as a class can't pay up, even if coerced, only individual women can. So this is the wrong way to describe the situation in any case.
This whole discussion started, I believe, with Robin Hanson's recent posts on Overcoming Bias. He presented a problem (some men want, even need more sex than they can get; and society is generally unsympathetic with them) but not a solution.
However, the notions of "owing" and suggestions of influencing or coercing women were very much present in the posts Robin linked to and in various comments there. That's not to say Robin agreed with them, of course.
Of course we're also objecting to that part of mainstream culture. When it's discussed here, we mention those objections here. After all the original topic was how to change mainstream culture for the better, not just our corner of it here.
No comments here have stated that men are owed sex from women as a group. The introduction of the concept was a straw man rebuttal to quoted claims and nobody has deigned to play advocate for the position, once included in the discussion. I cannot speak for the contents of posts on OvercomingBias.com.
For the record, I don't think this is accurate. In my opinion, the concerns raised by Alicorn and others were genuine and partially justified. Sex and gender relations are contentious topics in mainstream culture; we should keep this in mind and approach them cautiously.
A somewhat greater ability (and tendency) to make statements for purposes other than signalling. I for example, often point out fallacies in comments even when they argue for positions that I support. In many cases these rebuttals could be labelled 'frightening/scary'. If participants on LessWrong are closer in nature to myself than those in the general population are then I am less likely to take epistemic claims to be evidence of threat.
I support Kompos suggestion that significant benefit of the doubt should be given to posters when it comes to inferring danger from speaking on 'scary/frightening' topics. I do not believe I am owed more sex from anyone. The chain of inference 'Wedrifid supports people being allowed to say scary things -> Wedrifid believes scary things -> Wedrifid is likely to do scary things -> Wedrifid is dangerous' would not be a reasonable one to make in this circumstance.
Thus signaling your rationality, which confers value in this community :-)
I do agree with this. This being a rationality discussion site, we should absolutely be allowed to argue in support of any positions we actually hold, which may turn out to be scary or not. Only when the argument has taken place can the taboo option be (in theory) considered.
The status consequences are certainly lower here than elsewhere. However, my observations suggest that this the payoff is still negative, particularly when topics of any moral significance are being discussed in the context. We aren't that much Less Wrong.
I think a major reason why the LW community works and can derive useful insights, is that once we make rationality and objective truth our goals and deliberately associate them with higher status (via karma for instance), status seeking works in our favor.
It is certainly makes a noticeable difference compared to other communities I have been involved in with similar emphasis on intellectual pursuits (MENSA and university faculties).
The opposite of true would imply that the position makes enough sense for falsehood to neatly imply. The position is far more scrambled than that (not even wrong).
What's your prior probability that someone reading this thread (during, say, October 2009) has committed or will commit rape or sexual assault within ten years?
I think you are being extremely judgmental. I described my hypothetical character as "misunderstood", and indeed, here you are misunderstanding him. He's not dangerous; you can add that to the description: "shy, misunderstood, non-dangerous..." The fact that he "would never dream of saying such a thing except anonymously in an unusually open-minded online community" was intended to illustrate his kindness and sensitivity as a human being in contrast to the boorish brute I placed him in opposition to.
And if it's different from the probability for a randomly selected person, then why? (We should restrict selection to adult males, in both cases, for a fair comparison.) komponisto, you've said you think the fact someone is an LW participant reduces the probability he has or will rape. Why? Are there statistics negatively correlating rapes with IQ or something else relevant? (Not that I know, but I haven't checked thoroughly.)
As for your misunderstood character. What does he mean when he says women owe more sex to men? What does owing mean for a class, unless there are individuals who can be said to owe?
There are negative correlations between violent crime and IQ, and also positive ones between IQ and self-control, as well as any number of other relevant factors (being well-off, for example). I'd look up some citations for you, but really, those correlations are what you would expect and are easy to find.
(To play the devil's advocate, we could postulate that perhaps only bright male maladjusted losers post here, and the latter 2 attributes outweigh the former 2.)
I know the correlations with violent crime in general exist. We should still check the correlation for sexual assault in particular, because I don't know how different it may be from crime in general.
Playing devil's advocate, we assume here that some sexual assault is driven by feelings of entitlement, and rich, powerful, intelligent males tend to feel more entitled than average (and society supports those feelings in them). The powerful boss sexually assaulting his female secretary is practically a stereotype.