JGWeissman comments on The Correct Contrarian Cluster - Less Wrong

38 Post author: Eliezer_Yudkowsky 21 December 2009 10:01PM

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Comment author: PhilGoetz 23 December 2009 06:51:13AM 1 point [-]

The article says: "It should be obvious that there's some way to go downwind faster than the wind, because as so many people pointed out, sailboats do it." Sailboats do not go downwind faster than the wind. I have gone downwind hundreds or thousands of times on many different types of sailboats, and I have never seen the wind indicators streaming behind me as I did so.

Tacking sailboats are going upwind, not downwind.

The energy comes from harnessing the difference the difference between the velocity of the wind relative to the velocity of the ground.

Well, that's obvious. By definition of "wind power".

It may be helpful to refer to the 'propeller' as the 'propellee'. It is there to make sure the wind always has something to push on that is at roughly the same speed as the ground

The propeller is not at the same speed as the ground.

and only uses energy based on losses to drag and friction.

?

Comment author: JGWeissman 23 December 2009 07:31:54AM 3 points [-]

I have gone downwind hundreds or thousands of times on many different types of sailboats, and I have never seen the wind indicators streaming behind me as I did so.

Sailing downwind faster than the wind looks and feels like sailing upwind. How often have you, when the tell tales are streaming aft, checked to see if a stationary flag was blowing in the opposite direction?

You could also have sailed on many kinds of boats whose hulls experience too much water resistance before achieving the speed of the wind to accelerate further with the power provided by that wind.