mattnewport comments on The Craigslist Revolution: a real-world application of torture vs. dust specks OR How I learned to stop worrying and create one billion dollars out of nothing - Less Wrong

47 Post author: Kevin 10 February 2010 03:15AM

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Comment author: gwern 10 February 2010 10:57:39PM 7 points [-]

The absence of rule of law, democratic checks on the military, continual conflict and overall incompetence also increases the chances lab error or misuse of high tech weaponry as technology become more accessible while social, economic and political conditions do not improve.

I just had a fun idea: take this premise, and the demonstrated difficulty of improving Africa, and the idea that the development vs. likeliness-to-screw-everybody-over-with-WMDs curve would be an inverted U, and calculate the point at which it would be better to cut off all aid & begin bombing Africa into (or within) the Stone Age.

Comment author: Eliezer_Yudkowsky 12 February 2010 06:13:26PM *  23 points [-]

The version of this that I would put forward seriously is that the Westphalian concept of inviolable national sovereignty is a convenience to the rich and complacent inhabitants of successful nations, but a huge detriment to the inhabitants of failed states, condemning them to endless slavery at the hands of incompetent dictators who need fear no invasion as they weaken and starve their captive countries. Africa might benefit enormously from being conquered by almost anyone, including China.

Comment author: mattnewport 12 February 2010 06:21:19PM 7 points [-]

Probably the best thing that could be done for the poor of the world would be to greatly relax or eliminate immigration restrictions in developed nations. Of course that would be a little too much caring for the vast majority of citizens in the developed world. Far easier to salve your conscience with the occasional donation to charity than to actually have to live near these poor people!

Comment author: SilasBarta 12 February 2010 06:31:29PM 4 points [-]

True, but only up to a point. If you were to move everyone into a developed country ASAP, the "memetic overload" can destroy the very institutions that make those countries successful.

Yes, I know this sounds suspicously simliar to something a lot of racists say, but it's still true: if you add 100 random mouthbreathers to a five-man successful Silicon Valley startup, you don't get a 2000% improvement in productivity and a 5-fold gain in wages for the newcomers. Rather, you destroy the operation.

Comment author: mattnewport 12 February 2010 06:52:17PM 2 points [-]

Greatly relaxing or eliminating immigration restrictions wouldn't result in everyone moving from the developing world overnight. One of the main benefits of immigration in reducing poverty comes in the form of remittances back to family in the home country.

Comment author: gwern 12 February 2010 06:48:58PM -2 points [-]

Now now; if you're going to be in Hanson mode, at least credit him when you're not being original: http://www.overcomingbias.com/2009/12/microlending-fails.html

Comment author: Matt_Simpson 12 February 2010 07:02:42PM 3 points [-]

I'm not sure that Hanson was being original. Libertarian leaning economists have been making this argument for some time.

Comment author: mattnewport 12 February 2010 06:57:15PM 2 points [-]

I wasn't claiming to be original but I wouldn't credit Robin Hanson as the primary influence on me on this issue. Maybe Kerry Howley or Will Wilkinson should have got the credit.