Eliezer_Yudkowsky comments on Babies and Bunnies: A Caution About Evo-Psych - Less Wrong

52 Post author: Alicorn 22 February 2010 01:53AM

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Comment author: Alicorn 24 February 2010 10:55:44PM 0 points [-]

Does anyone know how to contact this blogger so I can correct em on my gender?!

Comment author: Eliezer_Yudkowsky 26 February 2010 04:00:07AM 6 points [-]
Comment author: RobinZ 26 February 2010 04:09:22AM 2 points [-]
Comment author: Kevin 26 February 2010 06:56:18AM 2 points [-]

Go go feminism police!

Comment author: Alicorn 26 February 2010 04:19:35AM 0 points [-]

Thank you!

Comment author: Wei_Dai 26 February 2010 10:02:50AM 1 point [-]

Why did Eliezer tell everyone here about another blogger who doesn't care enough about Alicorn to find out and use her preferred pronoun, instead of, say, just contacting that blogger directly? And why did people vote it up? Do they want to see more instances of such lack of caring to be reported here? I think I'm missing something here...

Comment author: ciphergoth 26 February 2010 10:34:11AM 5 points [-]

The blog post is of independent interest aside from the gender mixup.

Comment author: Wei_Dai 26 February 2010 10:58:43AM 0 points [-]

Ah, thanks. I guess my brain was so primed to think about the gender mixup that I missed the obvious.

Comment author: wedrifid 26 February 2010 10:10:03AM 3 points [-]

Do they want to see more instances of such lack of caring to be reported here? I think I'm missing something here...

I found the mere fact that a lesswrong post got that much external reference was interesting.

I don't think my personal vote should be taken as support of any 'lack of caring' about Alicorn, as that is not an inference I have made about the state of the mind of the blogger based on the evidence available. That is, I reject the framing of the question.

Comment author: Eliezer_Yudkowsky 26 February 2010 03:15:27PM 3 points [-]

I think I'm missing something here...

Er... a sense of humor? I regret only that I didn't get to see the look on her face in person, but I was kind of hoping for an AAAAAAAHHH in reply.

Comment author: Alicorn 26 February 2010 04:53:48PM 7 points [-]

Oh, I didn't realize my frustration was so entertaining. Should I stop exhibiting it, to create better incentives?

Comment author: ciphergoth 26 February 2010 06:28:36PM *  4 points [-]

While I generally get pissed off when people find my frustration entertaining, I'm not sure that's the correct inference here. I can be amused by my friends frustration in a way that, far from diminishing my sympathy for them, is actually borne of it. This is part of what amuses us about the Bill Hicks of this world.

Comment author: thomblake 26 February 2010 06:13:03PM 0 points [-]

Perhaps you should at least stop exhibiting it so amusingly. Lately it's sounded like something out of Peanuts.

Comment author: ciphergoth 26 February 2010 06:21:03PM *  8 points [-]

I think we should steer a lot further from high-school tropes. Right now you seem a whisker away from grabbing her stuff, offering it back to her, then throwing it to a mate when she reaches for it. I don't think that's exactly the atmosphere we're aiming for, do you?

Comment author: SilasBarta 26 February 2010 06:30:16PM *  2 points [-]

Agreed, and voted up.

With that said, note that the scienceblogs author and most of the commenters were female, and didn't make the inference, "alicorn = unicorn-related = probably female".

Comment author: Alicorn 26 February 2010 06:13:50PM 1 point [-]

What would be a clear, non-amusing, ideally empathy-inspiring expression of frustration?

Comment author: Kevin 27 February 2010 03:53:34AM 2 points [-]

A :( probably wouldn't hurt

Comment author: Alicorn 27 February 2010 03:54:29AM *  10 points [-]

People keep mistaking my gender and it makes me sad :(

Comment author: JoshuaZ 12 March 2011 04:05:34PM 8 points [-]

I'm a little curious why you care so much about people getting your gender correct online.

Speaking personally, I generally use my actual name in my screen name which to native English speakers shows my gender clearly. But even then, some non-native speakers see a name ending in "a" and apparently conclude that that's female.

Also, I have a very high-pitch voice for a male, so I regularly get mistaken for a female over the phone. But this isn't really that annoying except when it becomes an actual inconvenience (as in "I'm sorry ma'am, but I need to speak to your husband about this." and then refusing to believe that they really are speaking to Joshua Zelinsky).

So I'm curious why this preference issue is one that you place so much emphasis on.

Comment author: Dufaer 01 March 2010 10:01:48PM 6 points [-]

How is it even reasonable to expect some arbitrarily visitor to notice (or guess correctly) your gender?

Do you evaluate your writing style or your expressed thoughts to be so typically female as to yield to no other conclusion? Or do you count on the “obvious” connotations of a name like “Alicorn” - for it is surely obvious that anyone naming oneself thus must be thinking about some fluffy, girly sparkling unicorn instead of, for example, making a reference to the Invisible Pink Unicorn - or something (especially on a rationality website!).

There is no personal information on the user pages here on LS, and decidedly no gender marks on top of the posts themselves. Also, you are obviously not willing to provide any info to make you identifiable in RL and yet expect all people to infer that you are female anyway, even given the prior probability distribution (“there are no girls on the internet”, “a contributor on some intellectual/academia website”)?

Even when one does not think of people on the internet strictly as male, it is simply usually a better guess to refer to them as “he”, given that i) one is unwilling to use “he/she” or a similarly artificial form, and ii) there is no other information one is willing to look up.

Thus I conclude that as long as you do not change your nickname into something like “Alicorn(female!)” or change your expectations, you will be sad like this time and time again. [ :( ]

Comment author: Raemon 14 March 2011 01:49:16AM *  1 point [-]

I think it's an unfortunate but inescapable fact that people are unlikely to assume a given poster on a rationality site is female unless said poster has an obviously-female-name (and honestly, I don't think "Alicorn" counts. I had no idea what it meant until you explained).

But I AM genuinely offended by the Isgoria blogger proclaiming that male pronouns were "neutral", even when applied to a specific person. I'm not sure it was the optimal use of my time given the year old status of this discussion, but I sent an e-mail saying so. It gave me warm fuzzies, at least.

I think the male bias in the english language is a ridiculously obvious problem, and I am extremely frustrated whenever a someone says "hey, it'd be cool if you made a small effort to use gender neutral language" and the response is "dude, what's YOUR problem?"

(Originally I used male pronouns to refer to the Isgoria blogger, then realized I didn't actually know for sure. I'm 90% sure the blogger is male, and I don't think it's necessarily wrong to guess someone's gender wrong. But it also didn't take much effort to avoid the use of pronouns in the first place, and if we had an official actually neutral pronoun it wouldn't have been an issue.)

Comment author: Bugmaster 22 October 2012 06:19:47PM -1 points [-]

I mistook your gender as well, initially. In my defence, I had no idea what "Alicorn" meant, except that it sounded like "Unicorn". Unicorns are male more often than not, and the word "Unicorn" is male-gendered in my native language, which tipped my gender assignment all the way toward "male".

My point is, the people who are mistaking your gender may not be making any assumptions about you. They may just be making assumptions about unicorns.