wedrifid comments on The Blackmail Equation - Less Wrong

13 Post author: Stuart_Armstrong 10 March 2010 02:46PM

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Tags: decision_theory newcomblike decision winning meta rationality cooperation logic coordination

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Comment author: wedrifid 10 March 2010 10:01:03PM *  0 points [-]

What is the fact about which you see us disagreeing?

  1. You can modify your source code.
  2. You can make precommitments.
  3. "What could it mean to "make a precommitment"" is 'make a precommitment'. That is a distinct thing and 'signalling that you have made a precommitment". (If you make a precommitment and do not signal it effectively then it sucks for you.)
  4. More simply - on the point on which you were disagreeing with FAWS (I assert that)
    • FAWS' position does have meaning.
    • FAWS' meaning is a different meaning to what you corrected it to.
    • FAWS is right.

I don't understand this discussion as having a point of disagreement. From my point of view, we are arguing definitions, not facts.

It is probably true that we would make the same predictions about what would happen in given interactions between agents.

Comment author: Vladimir_Nesov 10 March 2010 10:11:45PM 0 points [-]
  1. You can modify your source code.

Sure, why not?

  1. You can make precommitments.
  2. "What could it mean to "make a precommitment"" is 'make a precommitment'.

Not helping!

That is a distinct thing and 'signalling that you have made a precommitment". (If you make a precommitment and do not signal it effectively then it sucks for you.)

Of course, having a strategy that behaves in a certain way and signaling this fact are different things. It isn't necessarily a bad thing to hide something (especially from a jumble of wires that distinguishes your thoughts and not just actions as terminal value).

  1. More simply - on the point on which you were disagreeing with FAWS (I assert that)
  2. FAWS' position does have meaning.
  3. FAWS' meaning is a different meaning to what you corrected it to.
  4. FAWS is right.

Not helping!

Comment author: wedrifid 10 March 2010 10:34:27PM 0 points [-]

Not helping!

No, it is not. You asked (with some implied doubt) where we disagree. I answered as best I could. As I stated, we are probably not going to resolve our disagreement so I will leave it at that, with no disrespect intended beyond, as Robin often describes, the inevitable disrespect implicit in the actual fact of disagreement.

Comment author: Vladimir_Nesov 10 March 2010 10:48:35PM 0 points [-]

The "Not helping!" parts didn't explain where we disagree (what are the facts I believe are one way and you believe are the other way), they just asserted that we do disagree.

But the last sentence suggests that we disagree about the definition of disagreement, because how could we disagree if you concede that

It is probably true that we would make the same predictions about what would happen in given interactions between agents.

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