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Morendil comments on Open Thread: April 2010 - Less Wrong
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Perhaps the folks at LW can help me clarify my own conflicting opinions on a matter I've been giving a bit of thought lately.
Until about the time I left for college, most of my views reflected those of my parents. It was a pretty common Republican party-line cluster, and I've got concerns that I have anchored at a point too close to favoring the death penalty than I should. I read studies about how capital punishment disproportionately harms minorities, and I think Robin Hanson had more to say about difference in social tier. Early in my college time, this sort of problem led me to reject the death penalty on practical grounds. Then, as I lost my religious views, I stopped seeing it as a punishment at all. I started to see it as a the same basic thing as putting down an aggressive dog. After all, dead people have a pretty encouraging recidivism rate.
I began to wonder if I could reject the death penalty on principle. A large swath of America believes that the words of the Declaration of Independence are as pertinent to our country as the Constitution. This would mean that we could disallow execution because it conflicts with our "inalienable" right to life. But then, I can't justify using the same argument as the people who try to prove that America is a Christian nation. As an interesting corollary, it seems that anyone citing the Declaration in this manner will have a very hard time also supporting the death penalty for this reason.
So basically, I think I would find the death penalty morally acceptable, but only in the hypothetical realm of virtual certainty that the inmate is guilty of a heinous crime. And I have no bound for what that virtual certainty is. Certainly a 5% chance of being falsely accused is too high. I wouldn't kill one innocent man to rid the world of 19 bad ones. But then, I would kill an innocent person to stop a billion headaches (an example I just read in Steven Landsburg's The Big Questions), so I obviously don't demand 100% certainty.
It seems like I might be asking: "What are the chances that someone was falsely accused, given that they were accused of an execution-worthy crime?" And a follow-up "What is an acceptable chance for killing an innocent person?"
Can Bayes help here? I am eager to hear some actual opinions on this matter. So far I've come up with precious little when talking to friends and family.
The more judicious question, I am coming to realize, isn't so much "Which of these two Standard Positions should I stand firmly on".
The more useful question is, why do the positions matter? Why is the discussion currently crystallized around these standard positions important to me, and how should I fluidly allow whatever evidence I can find to move me toward some position, which is rather unlikely (given that the debate has been so long crystallized in this particular way) to be among the standard ones. And I shouldn't necessarily expect to stay at that position forever, once I have admitted in principle that new evidence, or changes in other beliefs of mine, must commit me to a change in position on that particular issue.
In the death-penalty debate I identify more strongly with the "abolitionist" standard position because I was brought up in an abolitionist country by left-wing parents. That is, I find myself on the opposite end of the spectrum from you. And yet, perhaps we are closer than is apparent at first glance, if we are both of us committed primarily to investigating the questions of values, the questions of fact, and the questions of process that might leave either or both of us, at the end of the inquiry, in a different position than we started from.
Would I revise my "in principle" opposition to the death penalty if, for instance, the means of "execution" were modified to cryonic preservation? Would I then support cryonic preservation as a "punishment" for lesser crimes such as would currently result in lifetime imprisonment?
Would I still oppose the death penalty if we had a Truth Machine? Or if we could press Omega into service to give us a negligible probability of wrongful conviction? Or otherwise rely on a (putatively) impartial means of judgment which didn't involve fallible humans? Is that even desirable, if it was at all possible?
Would I support the death penalty if I found out it was an effective deterrent, or would I oppose it only if I found that it didn't deter? Does deterrence matter? Why, or why not?
How does economics enter into such a decision? How much, whatever position I arrive at, should I consider myself obligated to actively try to ensure that the society I live in espouses that position? For what scope of "the society I live in" - how local or global?
Those are topics and questions I encounter in the process of thinking about things other than the death penalty; practically every important topic has repercussions on this one.
There's an old systems science saying that I think applies to rational discussions about Big Questions such as this one: "you can't change just one thing". You can't decide on just one belief, and as I have argued before, it serves no useful purpose to call an isolated belief "irrational". It seems more appropriate to examine the processes whereby we adjust networks of beliefs, how thoroughly we propagate evidence and argument among those networks.
There is currently something of a meta-debate on LW regarding how best to reflect this networked structure of adjusting our beliefs based on evidence and reasoning, with approaches such as TakeOnIt competing against more individual debate modeling tools, with LessWrong itself, not so much the blog but perhaps the community and its norms, having some potential to serve as such a process for arbitrating claims.
But all these prior discussions seem to take as a starting point that "you can't change just one belief". That's among the consequences of embracing uncertainty, I think.
Yeah, that's why I try to avoid hot topics. Too much work.
Well, even relatively uncontroversial topics have the same entangled-with-your-entire-belief-network quality to them, but (to most people) less power to make you care.
The judicious response to that is to exercise some prudence in the things you choose to care about. If you care too much about things you have little power to influence and could easily be wrong about, you end up "mind-killed". If you care too little and about too few things except for basic survival, you end up living the kind of life where it makes little difference how rational you are.
The way it's worked out for me is that I've lived through some events which made me feel outraged, and for better or for worse the outrage made me care about some particular topics, and caring about these topics has made me want to be right about them. Not just to associate myself with the majority, or with a set of people I'd pre-determined to be "the right camp to be in", but to actually be right.