Amanojack comments on Rationality quotes: April 2010 - Less Wrong

5 Post author: wnoise 01 April 2010 08:41PM

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Comment author: Amanojack 03 April 2010 06:16:57PM *  6 points [-]

We originally want or desire an object not because it is agreeable or good, but we call it agreeable or good because we want or desire it.

-- Ludwig von Mises, Epistemological Problems of Economics

Comment author: AlanCrowe 03 April 2010 09:45:41PM 3 points [-]

This reminds me of B. F. Skinner's criticism of William James

A long time ago William James corrected a prevailing view of the relation between feelings and action by asserting, for example, that we do not run away because we are afraid but are afraid becase we run away. In other words, what we feel when we feel afraid is our behaviour -- the very behaviour which in the traditional view expresses the feeling and is explained by it. But how many of those who have considered James's argument have noted that no antecedent event has in fact been pointed out? Neither 'because' should be taken seriously. No explanation has been given as to why we run away and feel afraid.

Before he can add something of substance to the discussion of the epistemological problems of economics, Ludwig von Mises must look back in time, to previous events, and offer them as the explanation of why we want or desire things and why we also call those things agreeable or good.

Comment author: Amanojack 03 April 2010 10:30:21PM 4 points [-]

I think Mises's point is rather that concepts like "good," "bad," "evil," "right," "wrong," "ought to" and "rights" all reduce back down to variations on "I desire it"/"It brings me pleasure" and the opposite. In other words, all ethical systems are dressed up (subjective) consequentialism and they only appear otherwise due to semantic confusion.

Comment author: [deleted] 06 April 2010 03:35:40AM *  0 points [-]

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Comment author: Amanojack 06 April 2010 02:27:03PM 0 points [-]

Imagine that you got no satisfaction at all from bringing pleasure to others, but you did it anyway. What would be the reason?

Comment author: [deleted] 09 April 2010 12:43:55AM *  -1 points [-]

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Comment author: [deleted] 09 April 2010 01:04:33AM *  0 points [-]

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Comment author: ata 06 April 2010 04:13:49AM *  0 points [-]

The response to that would be that you only do things that give others pleasure because the feeling of helping others is pleasurable to you or because you expect something in return, and that if neither of those were the case, you wouldn't do it. (I don't necessarily agree with that — I'm pretty sure I don't — but I do believe that's how they'd reduce it.)

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