Morendil comments on Updating, part 1: When can you change your mind? The binary model - Less Wrong

11 Post author: PhilGoetz 13 May 2010 05:55PM

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Comment author: Morendil 13 May 2010 11:11:36PM 1 point [-]

Hold on - p(D|H) and P(D) are not point values but probability distributions, since there is yet another variable, namely what day it is.

Comment author: Cyan 14 May 2010 04:14:55AM 0 points [-]

The other variable has already been marginalized out.

Comment author: timtyler 14 May 2010 08:49:57AM 0 points [-]

So long as it is not Saturday. And the ideas that p(H) = ½ comes from Saturday.

Comment author: Morendil 14 May 2010 08:36:43AM 0 points [-]

But marginalizing over the day doesn't work out to P(D)=1 since on some days Beauty is left asleep, depending on how the coin comes up.

Here is (for a three-day variant) the full joint probability distribution, showing values which are in accordance with Bayes' Law but where P(D) and P(D|H) are not the above. We can't "change the values" willy-nilly, they fall out of formalizing the problem.

Frustratingly, I can't seem to get people to take much interest in that table, even though it seems to solve the freaking problem. It's possible that I've made a mistake somewhere, in which case I'd love to see it pointed out.

Comment author: Cyan 14 May 2010 06:14:24PM 0 points [-]

I was just talking about the notation "p(D|H)" (and "p(D)"), given that D has been defined as the observed data. Then any extra variables have to have been marginalized out, or the expression would be p(D, day | H). I didn`t mean to assert anything about the correctness of the particular number ascribed to p(D|H).

I did look at the table, but I missed the other sheets, so I didn`t understand what you were arguing.

Comment author: timtyler 14 May 2010 08:58:38AM 0 points [-]

It seems to say that p(heads|woken) = 0.25. A whole new answer :-(

Comment author: Morendil 14 May 2010 09:03:50AM 1 point [-]

That's in the three-day variant; it also has a sheet with the original.

Comment author: timtyler 14 May 2010 09:24:41AM 0 points [-]

It has three sheets. The respective conclusions are: p(heads|woken) = 0.25, p(heads|woken) = 0.33 and p(heads|woken) = 0.50. One wonders what you are trying to say.

Comment author: Morendil 14 May 2010 09:56:23AM 0 points [-]

That 1/3 is correct in the original, that 1/2 comes from allocating zero probability mass to "not woken up", and the three-day version shows why that is wrong.