mattnewport comments on Hacking the CEV for Fun and Profit - Less Wrong

52 Post author: Wei_Dai 03 June 2010 08:30PM

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Comment author: Vladimir_M 10 June 2010 06:44:39PM *  10 points [-]

Arguably, the concept of "individual" is incoherent even with ordinary humans, for at least two reasons.

First, one could argue that human brain doesn't operate as a single agent in any meaningful sense, but instead consists of a whole bunch of different agents struggling to gain control of external behavior -- and what we perceive as our stream of consciousness is mostly just delusional confabulation giving rise to the fiction of a unified mind thinking and making decisions. (The topic was touched upon in this LW post and the subsequent discussion.)

Second, it's questionable whether the concept of personal identity across time is anything more than an arbitrary subjective preference. You believe that a certain entity that is expected to exist tomorrow can be identified as your future self, so you assign it a special value. From the evolutionary perspective, it's clear why humans have this value, and the concept is more or less coherent assuming the traditional biological constraints on human life, but it completely breaks down once this assumption is relaxed (as discussed in this recent thread). Therefore, one could argue that the idea of an "individual" existing through time has no objective basis to begin with, and the decision to identify entities that exist in different instants of time as the same "individual" can't be other than a subjective whim.

I haven't read and thought about these problems enough to form a definite opinion yet, but it seems to me that if we're really willing to go for a no-holds-barred reductionist approach, they should both be considered very seriously. Trouble is, their implications don't sound very pleasant.

Comment author: mattnewport 10 June 2010 09:40:49PM *  2 points [-]

It strikes me that there's a somewhat fuzzy continuum in both directions. The concept of a coherent identity is largely a factor of how aligned the interests of the component entities are. This ranges all the way from individual genes or DNA sequences, through cells and sub-agents in the brain, past the individual human and up through family, community, nation, company, religion, species and beyond.

Coalitions of entities with interests that are more aligned will tend to have a stronger sense of identity. Shifting incentives may lead to more or less alignment of interests and so change the boundaries where common identity is perceived. A given entity may form part of more than one overlapping coalition with a recognizable identity and shifting loyalties between coalitions are also significant.