Mass_Driver comments on A Rational Identity - Less Wrong

31 Post author: Kaj_Sotala 12 July 2010 10:59PM

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Comment author: Vladimir_M 13 July 2010 07:31:26AM *  15 points [-]

Kaj_Sotala:

It seems to me that if we want to actually raise the sanity waterline and make people evaluate things critically, and not just conform to different groups than is the norm, a crucial part of that is getting people to adopt an identity of critical thinking. This way, the concept of identity ceases to be something that makes rational thinking harder and starts to actively aid it.

I don't think that could ever work. Just look at the present situation. A great many people nowadays feel that "critical thinking," "open-mindedness," "questioning authority," etc. are important parts of their identity, and will take offense if you suggest otherwise. The modern culture strongly encourages such attitudes. Yet, in practice, this nearly always results in cargo-cult "critical thinking" where one is merely supposed to display the correct shibboleths, accept the prevailing respectable beliefs, and avoid like plague any actual critical thinking about the truly sacrosanct taboos, values, and moral and intellectual authorities.

The old "We are all individuals!" sketch comes to mind.

Comment author: Mass_Driver 14 July 2010 04:44:04AM 0 points [-]

Your general point, that superficially critical thinking makes raising the sanity waterline even more difficult than it otherwise would be, is well-taken.

I don't think that could ever work. Just look at the present situation.

Isn't this, all by itself, an example of improper reasoning?

Comment author: Vladimir_M 14 July 2010 05:59:35AM *  0 points [-]

Isn't this, all by itself, an example of improper reasoning?

Yes, you are right -- we can't draw such a blanket conclusion just from observing the present situation. My choice of words wasn't very good there.

However, my conclusion is actually based on more than that, namely a more detailed consideration of both the human nature and the wider historical precedent. Unfortunately, it's a topic too complex to be discussed satisfactorily in a single comment, so I just wanted to draw attention to these unpleasant facts that are undoubtedly relevant for the point of the original post.