TobyBartels comments on Harry Potter and the Methods of Rationality discussion thread, part 2 - Less Wrong

13 Post author: dclayh 01 August 2010 10:58PM

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Comment author: TobyBartels 27 August 2010 04:39:24AM 2 points [-]

First you write

What on earth is he doing going about with grotesque supplication and begging for forgiveness?

Then you write

That weakness being Harry's overprotective romantic feelings for Hermione.

I think that you've answered your question.

Comment author: wedrifid 27 August 2010 08:39:49AM 1 point [-]

I think that you've answered your question.

And, in so doing reinforced the core thesis: Harry!Ch41 is a wuss. The overprotective thing can work, particularly when produces displays of dominance or heroism (eg. Christmas Eve dinner) but pointless supplication is the opposite of what he wants to be doing.

It totally breaks the flow of the story for me. If I am reading along empathising with the main character and he pulls stunts like this I feel a huge surge of revulsion. This is particularly the case if it seems like the behaviour is presented as a good moral that gives good results rather than "look at the naive character act like a git and then realise he needs to wise up!"

Comment author: TobyBartels 27 August 2010 06:15:09PM *  3 points [-]

And, in so doing reinforced the core thesis

Sure, I agree with that.

But I don't agree with this:

It totally breaks the flow of the story for me.

It finally made Harry seem like a real person to me again. I like seeing how MoR!Harry (and MoR!everybody) differs from canon, but sometimes he's a little too perfect.

look at the naive character act like a git and then realise he needs to wise up!

I expect that to happen in a later chapter. Surely EY doesn't think that Harry is acting sensibly? That would be a horror! (Unless Harry has some really devious plot that I don't anticipate, of course.)

Comment author: wedrifid 28 August 2010 02:42:22AM 1 point [-]

It finally made Harry seem like a real person to me again. I like seeing how MoR!Harry (and MoR!everybody) differs from canon, but sometimes he's a little too perfect.

That's just eh experience I got from chapter 36 (visiting the Grangers), my favourite chapter thus far.

I expect that to happen in a later chapter. Surely EY doesn't think that Harry is acting sensibly? That would be a horror! (Unless Harry has some really devious plot that I don't anticipate, of course.)

I think that's the thing for me. I actually aren't so sure. Some of the other foolish things Harry has done MoR!Author seems to be trying to convey as sensible decisions. For example... the other apology Harry has made to Hermione. When Hermione had panicked and cast finate incantatem on their transfiguration work. The apology itself was reasonable but it seemed like both Harry and MoR!Author were trying to convey that casting finate was a sane thing to do. Not, for example, isolating the room and running to fetch McGonagal. Being responsible doesn't mean turning off your brain at the first sign of danger!

ETA: The latest chapter was interesting. Less nauseating but more bizarre.

"Yeah," said Draco. "I understand."

Not.

"Yeah." said Draco. "Hey Harry, I've been meaning to thank you. It was your advice that allowed me to override my instincts up here. In fact, it was what allowed me to beat you. So let me return the favour and give you a lesson in personal boundaries that I learned when I was four."

Comment author: TobyBartels 29 August 2010 12:48:48AM *  0 points [-]

H'm, you may be right. Altough it may yet be accepted that Harry was overreacting.

Anyway, it leads to a nice introduction to Remus!

(Edit: add ‘although’ in first line, which is really what I meant all along.)

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