timtyler comments on Bloggingheads: Robert Wright and Eliezer Yudkowsky - Less Wrong

6 Post author: Liron 07 August 2010 06:09AM

You are viewing a comment permalink. View the original post to see all comments and the full post content.

Comments (127)

You are viewing a single comment's thread. Show more comments above.

Comment author: timtyler 07 August 2010 09:56:04AM *  3 points [-]

I think it is quite acceptable to describe technological evolution as "purposeful" - in the same way as any other natural system is purposeful.

‘Teleology is like a mistress to a biologist: he cannot live without her but he’s unwilling to be seen with her in public.’ Today the mistress has become a lawfully wedded wife. Biologists no longer feel obligated to apologize for their use of teleological language; they flaunt it. The only concession which they make to its disreputable past is to rename it ‘teleonomy’. - D. Hull.

So, I am sympathetic to Robert Wright. Evolution is a giant optimisation process, which acts to dissipate low-entropy states - and cultural evolution is evolution with a different bunch of self-reproducing agents.

Whether all the parts cooperate with each other or not makes no real difference to the argument. A goal-directed system doesn't need all of its sub-components to cooperate with each other. Cooperation adds up - while conflict cancels out. A bit of cooperation is more than enough - and as the internet shows, the planet has enough cooperation to construct large-scale adaptations.

Comment author: timtyler 07 August 2010 11:14:04AM *  3 points [-]

As Wright says, organisms are not that harmonious anyway. At every polymorphic locus, two alleles are engaged in a battle-to-the-death.

There is still enough cooperation for people to describe the resulting behaviour as "purposeful" - despite all the underlying replicator-level conflicts that produce it.