Vladimir_Nesov comments on Harry Potter and the Methods of Rationality discussion thread, part 3 - Less Wrong

5 Post author: Unnamed 30 August 2010 05:37AM

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Comment author: Vladimir_Nesov 06 September 2010 05:25:36AM 12 points [-]

Chapter 45. I wept.

Comment author: magfrump 06 September 2010 09:19:29AM 3 points [-]

(Chapter 45. I jumped up and down on the edge of my seat.)

Wedrifid's response to this makes me wonder how many people there might be here who aren't all fired up about defeating death. I get so excited when I think about it that I forget that some people are pro-death (including a few people that I care about very deeply.)

Comment author: TobyBartels 07 September 2010 01:28:50AM 8 points [-]

I'm not all fired up. I don't think that society is really anti-lifeist anymore than people who claim to believe in heaven really believe in it. Telling yourself that death is OK is a way to deal with the inevitability of death, and while this is bad (because you'll tend to ignore ideas, like cryonics and life extension, that hold some promise of defeating death) it won't last. Life extension doesn't get as much attention and effort as I would like, but when it has successes, these are gratefully accepted.

On the other hand, people's freedom is being interfered with, right now, because they want to die and our stringently anti-death society forces them to stay alive. That's what I get riled up about.

All the same, I loved the Humanism chapters. (The war stories were starting to get boring.) And while I don't find death the greatest evil in the world, I still agree with what Harry said about it.

Comment author: Perplexed 06 September 2010 07:12:37PM *  5 points [-]

I am probably one of those not-fired-up folks. I don't want to defend that position (or attitude, or whatever) here. But I can offer that, even for someone like me, Chapter 45 was an extremely effective exposition of the emotional attractiveness of the anti-death position.

Well done, EY!

Comment author: [deleted] 12 September 2010 07:58:58PM 2 points [-]

I'm the same way, as a personal matter. It's nothing I can defend. A person doesn't necessarily care, emotionally, about everything that it would make sense to care about.

Comment author: wedrifid 06 September 2010 10:19:39AM 1 point [-]

Wedrifid's response to this makes me wonder how many people there might be here who aren't all fired up about defeating death.

I am fired up about defeating death. (I also literally jumped to the edge of my seat in chapters 44 and 45.)

I rolled my eyes in 45 mostly when I reread it with 46 already in mind. I could see where Harry was inserting drama to set up a soap box for the future preaching. It soured the experience for me.

Comment author: orthonormal 06 September 2010 10:09:33PM 5 points [-]

It did have a "making the point with a sledgehammer" feel, although it's worth noting that Eliezer's not just preaching to the choir: MoR's intended audience has probably never had transhumanism/positive immortality expounded to them seriously before.

Comment deleted 06 September 2010 08:16:02AM *  [-]
Comment author: TobyBartels 07 September 2010 12:50:44AM *  3 points [-]

If you've got something to say, then just say it. You've made interesting comments before, including critical ones.

ETA: OK, you said it later.

Comment author: wedrifid 07 September 2010 02:49:41AM 0 points [-]

If you've got something to say, then just say it. You've made interesting comments before, including critical ones.

Giving a critique of the details of Eliezer's rhetorical construction would get me censored. Being censored is annoying. The appropriate response to annoyance is...

Comment author: Vladimir_Nesov 06 September 2010 08:42:26AM 0 points [-]

Death.