wedrifid comments on Harry Potter and the Methods of Rationality discussion thread, part 3 - Less Wrong

5 Post author: Unnamed 30 August 2010 05:37AM

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Comment author: wedrifid 18 September 2010 06:21:22PM *  1 point [-]

Second, you're comparing the immediate, apparently permanent and total defeat of a Dementor to the warm-fuzzy feelings from religion, and you're also comparing the risk of Harry being wrong about the possibility of eliminating death to the risk of someone with strong religious beliefs neglecting proper medical care. Both comparisons are deeply flawed, due to substitution effects.

I'm not doing either of those things. I did refer you to a document that explains why the author of HP:MoR believes self delusion is a mistake when it comes to important beliefs. That document did include extreme examples to demonstrate the principle tangibly.

It sounds to me like you're just upset

I downvoted this. I am disagreeing with you because you are confused about what rational decisions are. I have explained the reasons.

that he used the wrong ritual but it worked anyway.

It didn't work. Nor did it fail - success or failure in defeating death hasn't happened yet. I have no reason to expect that self delusion would prevent Harry from killing a dementor, which is why I never suggested that it would.

Comment author: Strange7 18 September 2010 07:00:44PM 0 points [-]

That article was about doing things you know to be wrong, in pursuit of a flawed 'greater good.' The specific worst-case was believing something you know to be false. What knowably false belief are you saying Harry has accepted in the face of contravening evidence?

Comment author: wedrifid 18 September 2010 07:07:41PM 1 point [-]

What knowably false belief are you saying Harry has accepted in the face of contravening evidence?

The one you conceded at the beginning of this conversation. This is the entire basis of the disagreement:

"Death shall lose" as an attitude may not be strictly correct, but under the circumstances it was instrumentally rational as demonstrated by the fact that it worked.

Comment author: Strange7 18 September 2010 08:29:08PM 1 point [-]

Ah, in that case I apologize for miscommunicating. By 'strictly correct' I meant 'literally, objectively true in the context of the story.' Whether Harry's goal is in fact possible most likely won't be revealed for quite some time; spilling the beans now wouldn't be dramatic. But, by the same token, it's not (yet?) knowably false.

I agree that Harry is being extremely, perhaps excessively, confident about something he can't really prove, and that such behavior is risky. However, it's an acceptable sort of risk, since he can always find contrary evidence later and change his mind, do something else with the rest of his life. The sort of risk entrepreneurs take. He hasn't hit any self-modifying point-of-no-return.

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