cupholder comments on Rationality Quotes: November 2010 - Less Wrong

5 [deleted] 02 November 2010 08:41PM

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Comment author: cupholder 10 November 2010 12:56:26PM 4 points [-]

This one felt quite LW-relevant:

If $1 million makes you happy, that doesn't mean $10 million will make you 10 times as happy.

It's good to be reminded now and then that dollars are not, in fact, utilons.

Comment author: shokwave 10 November 2010 02:26:11PM 1 point [-]

It's good to be reminded now and then that dollars are not, in fact, utilons.

The natural logarithm of dollars is a pretty good approximation of utilons, assuming you like candy-bars.

Comment author: NihilCredo 10 November 2010 08:32:51PM *  5 points [-]

With some constraints, of course.

"Here, have a penny."

"You bastard!"

Comment author: Unnamed 11 November 2010 08:59:13PM 2 points [-]

Here's some evidence from Stevenson & Wolfers that happiness/life satisfaction is proportional to the log of income: blog post, pdf article.

Comment author: Psy-Kosh 10 November 2010 11:40:05PM 2 points [-]

How does ln(dollars) approximate utilions? It's obvious that utilions are generally not fully linear in dollars, and they're certainly not equivalent, but how does the log of dollars, specifically, approximate utility?

Comment author: shokwave 11 November 2010 06:18:11AM 1 point [-]

If there is some mathematical reason why, I would love to know. I was going off the observation that the natural logarithm approximates the kind of diminishing returns that economists generally agree applies to the utility of wealth. This means that, very roughly, the logarithm of dollars is the 'revealed preference' utility.

It was actually more of a joke about that assumption, because it suggests that a 50 dollar meal is preferred four times as much to a 3 dollar candy bar - a bit odd, but perfectly natural if you like candy bars.

Comment author: JoshuaZ 11 November 2010 06:26:09AM *  3 points [-]

Well, log does that. But so does square root also. Lots of functions have diminishing marginal returns.

Comment author: b1shop 11 November 2010 06:48:38AM 1 point [-]

I can think of two good reasons to model diminishing returns with the natural log.

Logs produce nice units in the regression coefficients. A log-lin function (that is -- log'd dependent, linear independent) says that a percent increase in X results in a <coefficient> unit increase in Y. Similar statements are true for lin-log and log-log, the latter of which produces elasticities.

y=ln(x) and y=sqrt(x) will both fit data in a similar manner, so it makes sense to go with the one that makes for easy interpretation.

Additionally, the natural log frequently shows up in financial economics, most prominently in continuous interest but also notably in returns, which seem to follow the log-normal distribution.

Comment author: Manfred 11 November 2010 06:55:14AM 2 points [-]

Of course, there's the problem with pathological behavior near 0.

Or the utility of money could quite reasonably be bounded.

Comment author: shokwave 11 November 2010 06:40:48AM 0 points [-]

Hmm. If we grab some study data on wealth's mathematical relationship with utility, we might be able to decide what function best approximates it. As it is, yeah, there is no reason to prefer log to square root to anything other function.

Comment author: Psy-Kosh 11 November 2010 06:46:27PM 0 points [-]

Oooh, okay. Diminishing returns, certainly. Just not obvious that it would be "log" or near that.

It was actually more of a joke about that assumption, because it suggests that a 50 dollar meal is preferred four times as much to a 3 dollar candy bar - a bit odd, but perfectly natural if you like candy bars.

:)