David_Gerard comments on Rationality is Not an Attractive Tribe - Less Wrong

13 Post author: Alexandros 23 November 2010 02:08PM

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Comment author: FormallyknownasRoko 26 November 2010 08:08:52AM *  2 points [-]

being perceived as nice is one of the most important ways we can help ourselves in real life

not just for some, for all of us. It is in everyone's narrow self interest to sacrifice epistemology for signalling purposes. And in real life one has to do that. But here at least, I think that we should establish the opposite norm.

Look, what is the point of you trying to appear PC on LW? I for one am just not impressed. I already know that you're from a certain demographic that implies lots of good things about you. But it implies bad things about you if you can't turn off the the signalling BS in a context where it is socially very harmful, I.e. A rationality website.

Throughout the sequences it has been made clear that there usually is some local incentive for motivated cognition. Wanting to appear PC is no different: it's just another reason that people have for blowing their thought process up, with all the usual downsides, e.g. The downside that you often simply don't know what the cost will be because you would only be able to compute the cost of the motivated cognition if you were not engaging in it. Suffice it to say that I think we should have very strong norms against motivated cognition here on LW.

Comment author: David_Gerard 26 November 2010 02:29:20PM *  5 points [-]

As I see it, the problem there is that saying "we shouldn't be affected by this stuff" does not mean that we aren't affected by this stuff. Knowing your cognitive biases allows for workarounds - it doesn't cause them not to exist.

In particular, saying to others "you're smart people, you should not be affected by such nuances" and then not bothering to put them into place oneself is almost a cliched way to come across as an arsehole on the Internet and have people not want to bother listening to the speaker, no matter how right they may be. The message communicated is not "you should be affected less", but "I am inept." This reduces one's effectiveness.

Postel's law: "Be conservative in what you send; be liberal in what you accept."

If someone posts like a raging arsehole, they can be as right as they like, but people still won't welcome them or want to listen to them. It's not as effective a communication strategy as thinking before typing: your aim is to get the effect you want, not to win the conversation.

I speak here as a (hopefully) recovering arsehole. I have no plans to compromise the accuracy of what I'm saying, but it is useful to say it in a way that doesn't repel people from even reading.

Comment author: FormallyknownasRoko 26 November 2010 06:59:06PM 1 point [-]

Sorry, I don't understand you. Who said that someone should not be affected by cognitive biases?