Perplexed comments on Two questions about CEV that worry me - Less Wrong

29 Post author: cousin_it 23 December 2010 03:58PM

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Comment author: Perplexed 23 December 2010 07:04:55PM *  6 points [-]

... change in human values over time is mostly "progress" rather than drift. Do we have any evidence for that?

I'm pretty sure that it is not purely progress, that 'drift' plays a big part. I see (current) human values as having three sources.

  • Our innate moral intuitions - which arose by way of an evolutionary process with a good deal of drift in the mechanism. (To say nothing of a good deal of ecological and climatic contingency in the sequence of environments presented.)
  • Our moral training, which depends on historical facts about the success of different cultures with different religions and child-rearing practices.
  • The accumulated canon of ethical philosophy, which, as I read it, is not a tale of monotonic approach to reflective equilibrium.

I find it incredible that any thoughtful person who thinks about these sources would conclude that they produce pure 'progress', without a taint of 'drift'.

Comment author: jimrandomh 23 December 2010 08:36:18PM 1 point [-]

I find it incredible that any thoughtful person who thinks about these sources would conclude that they produce pure 'progress', without a taint of 'drift',

Who said anything about pure progress? A mixture of progress and drift is still a net improvement, unless there's something special about the starting point that makes drift a net negative.

Comment author: Perplexed 23 December 2010 09:11:15PM 1 point [-]

Who said anything about pure progress? A mixture of progress and drift is still a net improvement, unless there's something special about the starting point that makes drift a net negative.

Oh, I agree. But some people worry that if drift is not completely suppressed, over time it can completely reverse your goal structure

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