David_Gerard comments on Branches of rationality - Less Wrong

75 Post author: AnnaSalamon 12 January 2011 03:24AM

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Comment author: David_Gerard 12 January 2011 09:35:50PM 2 points [-]

Yeah. I've been thinking a bit about this. For some people, realising that they can think about thinking is revelatory, and the notion that they can change how they think is filled with fearful trepidation.

What other extremely basic things like this are there?

Comment author: jsalvatier 13 January 2011 05:11:07AM 3 points [-]

Do you have anecdotes about this? If you do I would be interested to hear them.

Comment author: David_Gerard 13 January 2011 11:50:11AM 3 points [-]

This sprang to mind with a particularly scary one - when I was out trolling the Scientologists in my dissolute youth.

A word about the victim who was already in there. She was a good example of Scientology working on people only insofar as they actually notice their minds for the first time EVER - which will be a productive thing - and then attribute any gains to Scientology itself rather than their own efforts. She was utterly BLOWN AWAY by the meagre thrill of a chat about Dianetics, to the point of going out right there and then to get $100 out of the bank to buy a course.

This is what you can get from just getting someone to notice their mind for the first time, and taking the credit for such.

Comment author: jsalvatier 13 January 2011 05:41:56PM 1 point [-]

I'd be interested in hearing more about this. Are there a lot of people like this? Are there polite ways to introduce people to this notion (I imagine some people would be somewhat insulted if you assumed they didn't have this notion)?

Comment author: David_Gerard 13 January 2011 05:49:02PM *  1 point [-]

That's the thing - I don't know! But it's such a HUGE WIN technique.

And a serious susceptibility, if you're introduced to it by the Renfields of a parasitic meme. And even if you already have it, if they get in through your awareness of the power of the idea of self-improvement.

I'm also wondering at other techniques - such as how to teach the notion of rationality by starting with small-scale instrumental rationality and expanding from there. I have no idea if that would work, but it sounds plausible. Of course, that can lead to the Litany of the Politician: "If believing this will get me what I want, then I want to believe this." I expect I'd need to come up with a pile of this stuff then actually test it on actual people.

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