bentarm comments on Rationality Quotes: March 2011 - Less Wrong

6 Post author: Alexandros 02 March 2011 11:14AM

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Comment author: bentarm 02 March 2011 01:53:46PM 43 points [-]

Cryonics is an experiment. So far the control group isn't doing very well.

Dr. Ralph Merkle (quoted on the Alcor website - I'm surprised this hasn't been posted before, but I can't find it in the past pages)

Comment author: MartinB 02 March 2011 02:18:07PM 16 points [-]

Reminds me of the proposed double blind studies about the effectiveness of parachutes in preventing injuries while falling from great heights.

Comment author: XFrequentist 02 March 2011 06:31:19PM *  9 points [-]

I thought it was trite, but here it is.

ETA: Posted this from work, didn't realize it was paywalled. Here's a pdf

Comment author: alexflint 03 March 2011 09:24:56AM *  4 points [-]

Brilliantly done, no matter the point they were trying to make. The headings say it all...

Evidence based pride and observational prejudice

Natural history of gravitational challenge

The parachute and the healthy cohort effect

The medicalisation of free fall

Parachutes and the military industrial complex

A call to (broken) arms

Comment author: Nominull 03 March 2011 03:56:29AM 3 points [-]

They're technically not incorrect, but they are on the wrong side of the debate. It's true that we can occasionally understand things without directly experimenting on them, but we could use more experiment, not less.

Comment author: ChristianKl 03 March 2011 01:07:45PM 8 points [-]

If you say that all experiments have to be placebo controlled double blind experiments you aren't advocating more experiments.

You are advocating that the resources get spread about over less experiments but that those experiments that are done have a higher standard. http://www.blog.sethroberts.net/2011/01/25/monocultures-of-evidence/

Comment author: MartinB 03 March 2011 07:15:58PM 4 points [-]

The interesting thing is often not if a treatment method works but how it compares to other methods. Afaik in cancer research often groups get different treatment that then gets compared. Sadly it seems that correct statistical knowledge is not too widely spread in all places where needed. I read a book of german medical professors who dearly complained about that. There is no need to slavishly follow one standard of testing. What would be awesome were a better understanding on how to get good results with the least effort (in case of medics: least ppl. treated ineffectively).

Comment author: IlyaShpitser 05 March 2011 07:04:18PM *  4 points [-]

While more controlled experiments are undoubtedly a good thing, observational studies are often not useless, since one can often make a plausible argument for extracting causation from them. Sadly, the default state of causal analysis in medicine remains "use regression."

Comment author: MartinB 03 March 2011 01:56:32AM 0 points [-]

Oh boy.

Comment author: Waldheri 05 March 2011 05:47:48PM 4 points [-]

Which in turn reminds me of The Onion news piece 'Multiple Stab Wounds May Be Harmful To Monkeys'. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cQ7J7UjsRqg

Comment author: DSimon 02 March 2011 02:55:18PM 30 points [-]

Well, to be fair, the experimental group isn't doing a lot better either, just yet.

Comment author: gwern 02 March 2011 07:43:12PM *  12 points [-]

On the living/non-living part, yeah. (They're all dead.)

On the brains remaining recognizable and intact, I suspect they're doing better than even professionally embalmed and maintained corpses like Lenin or Mao are.

Comment author: wedrifid 03 March 2011 01:08:43AM 6 points [-]

On the living/non-living part, yeah. (They're all dead.)

For a certain value of 'dead'.

Comment author: Psy-Kosh 03 March 2011 04:28:25AM 18 points [-]

More precisely, an uncertain value of 'dead'.

Comment author: danlowlite 04 March 2011 03:06:00PM *  11 points [-]

Miracle Max: Whoo-hoo-hoo, look who knows so much. It just so happens that your friend here is only MOSTLY dead. There's a big difference between mostly dead and all dead. Mostly dead is slightly alive. With all dead, well, with all dead there's usually only one thing you can do.

Inigo Montoya: What's that?

Miracle Max: Go through his clothes and look for loose change.

Comment author: CronoDAS 05 March 2011 04:04:12AM 4 points [-]

I personally added "Cryonics patients" to the Only Mostly Dead TV Tropes Wiki page. (I am not responsible for the current wording.)

Comment author: MBlume 05 March 2011 06:12:49PM 6 points [-]

Holy shit, I just went to TV Tropes, read one page, and came back. How did that just happen, exactly?

Comment author: danlowlite 07 March 2011 02:59:01PM 11 points [-]

It would be a miracle.

Comment author: FiftyTwo 11 September 2011 06:50:09PM 1 point [-]

Possibly the best test of willpower known to humanity.

Comment author: James_Miller 02 March 2011 09:04:18PM 3 points [-]

They are in terms of expected value.