DavidM comments on Meditation, insight, and rationality. (Part 2 of 3) - Less Wrong

25 Post author: DavidM 04 May 2011 10:38PM

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Comment author: AdeleneDawner 06 May 2011 02:24:03PM *  5 points [-]

It's possible, but as DavidM says, one probably has to have rather unusual starting conditions.

My natural state of mind has, to the best of my admittedly spotty memory, always been essentially the same as what DavidM describes as stage four, and I've had at least one and possibly several experiences that match what he describes as enlightenment - I just never realized that they were particularly noteworthy or related to that until now. I'm good at meditating, in the sense of being able to just concentrate on one thing for a relatively long period of time (I find 10-15 minutes to be relatively effortless), but I've never made a habit of it.

I do find it plausible that meditation is the easiest way for someone whose native state is stage one to learn to enter and sustain stage four. I also find it plausible that drugs can accomplish that (I know of a particular, thankfully unusual, food additive that will send me into stage one, and avoid it like the bad trip that it is), but can't speak for specific ones.

ETA: Oh, except that I have no clue what he's talking about with 'vibrations', unless he's talking about a particular experience I've been known to have when improperly caffeinated. They aren't any usual part of my experience.

Comment author: DavidM 06 May 2011 03:09:19PM 1 point [-]

Thanks for sharing your experience.

I don't know whether 'vibrations' are necessarily observable by anyone who has passed through any of these stages, or are just a side effect of the specific exercises I prescribe to cultivate attention, which would not occur if someone has passed through the stages by another method.

Comment author: donjoe 19 July 2011 06:29:38AM 0 points [-]

So vibrations will not necessarily be observed by everyone doing this kind of meditation? Well how are stage 1 newbies supposed to keep their hopes up during their practice if the main marker of stage 2 isn't a sure thing even if you're doing everything right?