JackEmpty comments on Community roles: teachers and auxiliaries - Less Wrong

7 Post author: calcsam 22 June 2011 10:52AM

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Comment author: pjeby 24 June 2011 03:14:10PM 0 points [-]

Self control is an important element in influencing others, and as such it is central to negotiation theory. So is interpreting the world as it actually is. Clearly communicating one's desires without having them interpreted as anything more demanding than a request (i.e. NVC) is useful, but it is only one way to interact with people and will not always be ideal, even among those one is emotionally intimate with.

I didn't say negotiation and NVC didn't have areas of overlap, I said there were areas where their goals might be in conflict. Not the same thing. (I also didn't say that negotiation was always zero-sum, I said that zero-sum negotiation was an area where conflicts with NVC would likely exist.)

Compare the HNP core concerns, the Max-Neef needs, and the NVC needs inventory for more insight.

You could also look at my own SASS model, or the Murray-Bennett-Robbins models found in lots of self-help stuff. (See e.g. Robbins' TED talk about the six human needs.) There's also a recent 16-point needs model that lists all the same stuff, organized differently. (I don't remember the scientist's name right off, sorry.)

Pretty much every model of human needs ends up with the same big list, just grouped differently as far as categories. And what categorization you use really depends on what functional goals you have for applying your model, rather than there being any epistemologically "correct" classification. (Well, in theory, there's whatever physical groupings that occur in the brain or genome, but there's no point in waiting until we know that before we use the information we have.)

In general, when one is trying to train people to achieve some practical result, the best categorization to use is one that is both mnemonic, and closely tied either to the actions students need to take, and/or to the diagnostic/classification criteria they'll be using. So, HNP, NVC, and I can all have quite legitimate reasons for categorizing the basic needs differently, depending on what we intend to train people to do.

Comment author: JackEmpty 24 June 2011 03:58:43PM *  1 point [-]

To respond to this whole thread of discussion, what it seems to me is that NVC is a quite useful tool, and negotiation theory is the toolbox and instruction manuals.

It also seems that NVC could be a better designed tool (that's not to say that it won't do it's job!), and that negotiation theory could be a better formulated heuristic of when to use the NVC-tool, and when to use the other tools...

My concern is now cutting the cruft from both and adding the useful bits into the repertoire of my own rationality.

I'll have to look into them both further before I make any more in-depth of a comment than that, though.

ETA: Any recommendations on where to start reading up? (Free/online preferrable.)