jschulter comments on Rationalist Judo, or Using the Availability Heuristic to Win - Less Wrong

21 Post author: jschulter 15 July 2011 08:39AM

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Comment author: pjeby 15 July 2011 08:53:26PM 1 point [-]

Establishing 'pull' motivation' works best with strong visualization, and is reinforced upon experiencing the completion of the task.

To be clear, are you making a general statement here, or describing experimental results from the conference? And if this is from experimental results, could you elaborate on the specific evidence that led to these conclusions?

That is, what specifically do you mean by "strong visualization" and "reinforced", not to mention "experiencing the completion"? Thanks!

Comment author: jschulter 18 July 2011 04:20:43PM 0 points [-]

The statement about strong visualization (essentially simulating experiences as closely as possible) is taken from the video and personal (and anecdotal) experience with the method. The reinforcement from actual completion refers to how once you've completed the task you were motivating yourself to do, you should get the feeling of reward you were imagining to motivate yourself. Actually experiencing the reward makes it easier to simulate if you need to become motivated again later. Additionally the mental connection you'll make between completing the task and the reward makes it less likely that you'll need to repeat the exercise for that task, unless it has an extremely high activation cost: the next time you go to do the task, one of the first things that comes to mind will likely be the reward you felt last time(s) you performed it.

Comment author: pjeby 18 July 2011 11:06:00PM 4 points [-]

Perhaps I wasn't clear; I wasn't asking for your conclusions (which were already stated) or your hypothesized mechanisms for those conclusions, but rather, I was asking for evidence and definitions. Would you be willing to share the evidence that led you to formulate the above hypotheses?

I am particularly concerned because some of what you have said sounds like the sort of thing that one might anticipate about the process, but which is not actually the case at all. For example, I have seen no evidence of a reinforcement process such as you describe. (Quite the opposite in fact.) So, if you have actually measured or demonstrated such a reinforcement effect, I would be most curious to know how.

There are other things you're saying that also appear to me to be contrary to actual fact (as opposed to one's intuitive expectations that are easily confirmation-biased into appearing real), so I would really like to find out what specific evidence you have and what contrary explanations you've tested, because I don't wish the efficacy of the technique to be overstated. (Thereby presenting others with something to criticize, never mind that I wasn't the one who made the overstated claim(s).)

Thanks.

Comment author: jschulter 21 July 2011 06:16:26PM 1 point [-]

Okay, thanks for clarifying the question. I've essentially already stated all the "evidence" I'm using for the claim, it's almost entirely anecdotal, and there's certainly no actual studies that I've used to support this particular bullet point. So, there is a good chance I may have stated things in a way which seems overconfident, and I may in fact be overconfident regarding this particular claim, especially considering that I've not tested alternate explanations for the efficacy I've had. I'd be more than willing to have a detailed discussion regarding both of our experiences/intuitions with the method, but I feel as though this probably isn't the place(I've already messaged you), though I'd be happy to update the wording of the article afterwards if it's necessary.

Comment author: pjeby 21 July 2011 09:28:02PM *  0 points [-]

Okay, thanks for clarifying the question. I've essentially already stated all the "evidence" I'm using for the claim, it's almost entirely anecdotal, and there's certainly no actual studies that I've used to support this particular bullet point.

I don't take issue with anecdotal evidence; it's the complete lack of any specifics whatsoever that's a problem. Even well-run studies are routinely misunderstood, misinterpreted and miscommunicated due to lack of relevant detail.

I'd be more than willing to have a detailed discussion regarding both of our experiences/intuitions with the method

I'm curious about the experiences that led you to the claims that you're making. I really don't want the intuitions or the reasoning behind your interpretations, because I don't want to contribute to erasing the information I really want from your brain. i.e., I'm trying to avoid witness tampering, although it may already be too late for that. ;-)

For the same reason, I'm not interested in a "discussion". I just want facts, or at least a reasonably-specific anecdote about them. ;-)

Anyway, if you'd be willing to share the specific experiences that led you to your conclusions -- and only the experiences, not the reasoning or conclusions -- please do so, whether publicly or privately.

Thanks.