Tyrrell_McAllister comments on How to understand people better - Less Wrong

76 Post author: pwno 14 October 2011 07:53PM

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Comment author: Vaniver 11 October 2011 11:44:22PM *  7 points [-]

Alice is not "lying".

If by this you mean "Alice would explode at being called a liar," then I agree.

You cannot reduce human communication in these circumstances to the explicit meaning of words.

Communication is the transfer of information from speaker to listener: while I cannot reduce intent to the explicit meaning of words in this case I can reduce actual transfer to the explicit meaning of words (and a bit extra). The man in question is likely to be literal-minded, otherwise he would have picked up on the hint. (Men tend to be more literal than women.) Alice is the one who has an easier path to avoid communication breakdown.

she may not want to get into a fight about when they talk about it

They are in a fight about when they talk about it, and she is the one that elevated it from discussion to fight.

she may want Bob to figure it out for himself

This habit is not conducive to relationship success.

Comment author: Tyrrell_McAllister 12 October 2011 02:11:24AM 2 points [-]

Alice is not "lying".

If by this you mean "Alice would explode at being called a liar," then I agree.

No, he means that Alice fails to satisfy the literal definition of lying, in that she is not intending to deceive. That is, she does not mean for the man to conclude that there is in fact nothing wrong.

Comment author: Vaniver 12 October 2011 02:36:30AM 0 points [-]

No, he means that Alice fails to satisfy the literal definition of lying, in that she is not intending to deceive.

Emphasis mine. My dictionary contains four instances of "lie" as a noun; #3 applies, and #1 (the one you're using) applies under the interpretation espoused by the person whose comment I was responding to (i.e. TimS suggested she wants him to conclude, for now at least, that nothing is wrong).

Comment author: Tyrrell_McAllister 12 October 2011 03:36:14AM *  1 point [-]

If you have read TimS correctly, then we agree that she was lying. But your reading of TimS doesn't look very plausible to me. Alice's not wanting to talk now doesn't convey the message that nothing is wrong now.

Comment author: Jack 12 October 2011 02:51:09AM *  1 point [-]

I think what TimS probably meant was that she wants him to act, at least for now, as if nothing is wrong. But I probably shouldn't have jumped on you for criticizing him (I was not focused enough on the context, ironically).