buybuydandavis comments on Whining-Based Communities - Less Wrong

59 Post author: Eliezer_Yudkowsky 07 April 2009 08:31PM

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Comment author: Aurini 07 April 2009 10:53:26PM 8 points [-]

I always interpreted the 'Looters and Moochers' differently; a corollary to the 'It's okay to Win,' statement saying 'It's okay that others Lose - they did so by their own hand.' Rather than offering an excuse for Rationalists/Ubermenschs/Super-Geeks to say 'Nice guys finish last,' I read it as an indictment of that very behaviour. Only 'Looters and Moochers' make excuses, blame others, and fault circumstances - the Super-Geek Wins despite all of those.

I'd wager that Ayn Rand would agree with me if I said this to her (if she wasn't too busy denouncing me for being a Libertarian), but what she intended is irrelevant when speaking about the effects of her work; and along those lines I think you hit the nail on the head. The self-proclaimed Objectivists I've met have all given off a creepy vibe. I think it might be due to misinterpreting Rand in precisely the way you described.

They call themselves Winners, imagine themselves as heroic protagonists (far superior to plebs like you) despite never having actually Won anything; it's all society's fault.

They might as well say: "Oh, I was behaving as a good Rationalist, but my opponent was Irrational! It's not my fault!"

Eliezer FTW.

Comment author: buybuydandavis 19 February 2012 12:52:01AM 2 points [-]

The self-proclaimed Objectivists I've met have all given off a creepy vibe. I think it might be due to misinterpreting Rand in precisely the way you described.

They call themselves Winners, imagine themselves as heroic protagonists (far superior to plebs like you) despite never having actually Won anything; it's all society's fault.

They might as well say: "Oh, I was behaving as a good Rationalist, but my opponent was Irrational! It's not my fault!"

Did they say "I'm a winner" in your presence? How did you know what they imagined? That you felt a "creepy vibe" says more about you than them. Where else have you felt this "creepy vibe"? I don't see a lot of extensional facts in your criticisms of Objectivists. I just see that you clearly don't like them.

The Objectivists I have personally known have been fine, decent, fun people. A married couple that went off to be professors at the University of Georgia. I knew the husband better, and played tennis with him while we were both in grad school. Neither of us were very good, but it was exercise.

They invited me over to their house a few times to play bridge and have drinks with some of their other friends, all Objectivist leaning, if not Objectivists. I always had a good time. They never told me they were "Winners". The discussions were lively, honest, and interesting. They gave me quite a pleasant vibe, of honest, rational people who didn't have a lot of time for trying to getting ahead by snearing at other people.