NancyLebovitz comments on Akrasia and Shangri-La - Less Wrong

38 Post author: Eliezer_Yudkowsky 10 April 2009 08:53PM

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Comment author: ialdabaoth 16 February 2013 07:51:40PM 2 points [-]

This is precisely how I feel about most self-help and productivity advice, except substituting "mind" for "bodies", and "procrastinator" for "fat person". ;-)

The fact that it feels precisely identical should not be surprising at all - precisely the same mechanism is occurring in both cases.

Mental health/productivity and physical health/fitness are both situations that have a massive social stigma, and a massive incentive for people who are (to use Msr. Yudkowski's term) "privileged" to function in a manner that allows them to achieve socially acceptable results by performing socially acceptable procedures.

The fact is, our culture (and regrettably, ESPECIALLY the sort of people who are attracted to lesswrong) thrives on the sort of "but I'm better than that!" thinking that leads directly to prejudiced bullshit about "willpower" and "not trying hard enough" and "wanting to fail" and "ugly fat fucks" and "useless social retards" and "parasite welfare queens". Because, as a species of social primate thrust into a constant high-stress environment, those of you who are constantly receiving cortisol/dopamine signals that you're just-barely-making-it-but-look-out-for-that-tiger need people to feel superior to.

Comment author: NancyLebovitz 13 September 2013 10:41:54AM 2 points [-]

I find that LW has much less of the prejudiced bullshit you describe than mainstream culture, probably because of the common belief that willpower isn't magic.

Comment author: ialdabaoth 13 September 2013 11:58:24PM 1 point [-]

Interesting. I would very much like to also find that LW has much less of that prejudiced bullshit. Can you think of a way that our behaviors might lead to our differences in experience, so that I might experience more of the LW that you are experiencing?

Comment author: NancyLebovitz 14 September 2013 08:44:38AM 2 points [-]

I suspect that I've got some tendency towards "glass half full"-- I tend to notice the good stuff.

Also, LW being better on the issue than the mainstream doesn't mean that LW is consistently good, just that it isn't resoundingly awful.

This update from CFAR is a good example on LW of supporting skillful means rather than just blaming people who aren't doing well.

Comment author: Eugine_Nier 14 September 2013 03:06:58AM 0 points [-]

willpower isn't magic.

True on the other hand, social pressure is a great way to fight akrasia. On the other hand telling people they have no control over their actions is a great way to promote akrasia.

Comment author: NancyLebovitz 14 September 2013 08:46:34AM 1 point [-]

Social pressure works to oppose akrasia.... except when it doesn't work. Some people end up crushed rather than pushed in a useful direction.

Comment author: [deleted] 14 September 2013 05:02:18PM 0 points [-]