gwern comments on Harry Potter and the Methods of Rationality discussion thread, part 10 - Less Wrong

11 Post author: Oscar_Cunningham 07 March 2012 04:46PM

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Comment author: Psy-Kosh 12 March 2012 06:54:07PM 12 points [-]

Another thought: write down a description of a complex magical principle that you understand, but that the interdict of merlin would prevent someone else who was reading it from understanding. Use the parchment you wrote on as an ingredient in a potion to make a potion with the mental work needed to discover/comprehend that principle.

Poof, Interdict of Merlin loses its teeth entirely. :)

Another thought that occurred to me: Felix Felicis. No wonder it's hard to brew. Only way you could brew it is if you literally got lucky in the process of brewing it, by chance, so that you can take that "chance" and put it into the potion.

(hrm... might be able to automate the process of making Felix: Have a machine that keeps mixing the ingredients many times in parallel, ie, many "potential potions", and in the process does something like for each potential potion, has a coin (or some random bit source which can then be physically placed in the potion) which it flips a 100 times. It also tracks the results, and when one of the coins comes up all heads, it drops it into the candidate potion then calls up the wizard to complete the potion.)

Oh, and MoR!Snape did claim you could brew fame and stuff. That was one of the things MoR!Harry challenged him on, saying something like "How does that work anyways? You drink it and turn into a celebrity?"

Or, wait, an even more recursive version of your science power potion:

Make a clever potion. Use that potion as an ingredient in a potion to extract the mental work of creating a clever potion.

Use that potion as an ingredient... repeat. :)

Comment author: Bakkot 12 March 2012 07:23:01PM 10 points [-]

Make a clever potion. Use that potion as an ingredient in a potion to extract the mental work of creating a clever potion.

Entertainingly, precisely this trick can be used in Morrowind to beat what is meant to be a 20-40 hour game in a matter of minutes. Global victory condition, indeed.

I have to imagine there is no "clever potion" in MoR, though, because otherwise Harry would have seized on it instantly. It's too much like the recursive self-improvement we look for in AIs for Eliezer or Harry to have missed this possibility.

Comment author: gwern 12 March 2012 08:17:04PM *  1 point [-]

And we'd expect Ravenclaw members to already be using any clever potions or at least have rules against them (either imposed by the school or by themselves as 'cheating'). In canon, they all know about the Ravenclaw diadem which is supposed to make you more clever. So it's reasonable if there were any such thing, Harry would have been told about it (everyone knowing his interest in self-improvement or being more clever), heard of it, or read about it by now.

Comment author: Anubhav 13 March 2012 11:10:04AM 3 points [-]

So it's reasonable if there were any such thing, Harry would have been told about it

Yes, because people want Harry Potter to be smarter than he is.

Comment author: Fergus_Mackinnon 13 March 2012 09:04:44PM 4 points [-]

If it existed and was semi-public knowledge, then Lucius would have made a priority of acquiring some for Draco.

Comment author: marchdown 14 March 2012 09:18:23PM 4 points [-]

Draco doesn't even need to know about this.

Comment author: sketerpot 14 March 2012 07:22:49AM 4 points [-]

Who says he didn't? I notice that Draco is unusually bright, as are Crabbe and Goyle. It would certainly be convenient for the Malfoys if the youngest sons of all three families were significantly above average....

Comment author: Anubhav 14 March 2012 02:03:26AM 0 points [-]

^ Truth.