gwern comments on Harry Potter and the Methods of Rationality discussion thread, part 13, chapter 81 - Less Wrong

6 Post author: bogdanb 27 March 2012 06:07PM

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Comment author: gwern 28 March 2012 03:07:07AM 6 points [-]

I have to say, I enjoyed the process of coming up with and justifying my 'throw Dumbledore under the bus' theory a lot more than I actually enjoyed the chapter, which wound up looking like a mish-mosh (a debt and messing with Dementors and Hermione joining the House of Potter and foreshadowing)...

Comment author: Eugine_Nier 28 March 2012 06:49:42AM 9 points [-]

I enjoyed the process of coming up with and justifying my 'throw Dumbledore under the bus' theory

That's a very bad mental habit to get into. As Bryan Caplan explains here.

The key difference between a normal utilitarian and a Leninist: When a normal utilitarian concludes that mass murder would maximize social utility, he checks his work! He goes over his calculations with a fine-tooth comb, hoping to discover a way to implement beneficial policy changes without horrific atrocities. The Leninist, in contrast, reasons backwards from the atrocities that emotionally inspire him to the utilitarian argument that morally justifies his atrocities.

Comment author: gwern 28 March 2012 03:30:10PM 1 point [-]

I don't think I wanted to get rid of Dumbledore beforehand; but the solution dealt with all the desiderata in one single stroke, as opposed to the actual chapter which was an unsatisfying potpourri of solutions. Cute quote anyway.

Comment author: Eugine_Nier 29 March 2012 12:54:18AM 1 point [-]

but the solution dealt with all the desiderata

Except for the whole "not throwing anyone under the bus" thing.

Comment author: gwern 29 March 2012 01:05:20AM 5 points [-]

No, as I pointed out, one would expect, based on its past performance, the dark side to come up with disastrous yet simple and effective solutions, and this expectation is another desiderata. Which that solution filled as well.

(A token 'dispel the Patronuses and make the Dementors eat people' is at least a gesture in the right direction, for all that I find Harry's belief he can cripple Aurors like that to be risible - if you yell at a pilot 'actually it doesn't run on the Bernouilli effect but spiral vortices' or whatever, does he immediately panic and fly into the ground? Of course not, years of training and experience make him do the right thing, just like the Aurors' years/centuries of experience conjuring and maintaining Patronuses would override some weird statement by an odd kid.)

Comment author: pedanterrific 29 March 2012 04:47:18AM 0 points [-]

the Aurors' years/centuries of experience

I thought mandatory retirement was set at one century?

Comment author: gwern 29 March 2012 01:48:23PM 0 points [-]

It sounds like a modern thing, such retirements usually have loopholes or exceptions, and Patronus casting would start either in Hogwarts or Auror training; all of which could push Aurors well over the century mark.