pragmatist comments on Ask an experimental physicist - Less Wrong

35 Post author: RolfAndreassen 08 June 2012 11:43PM

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Comment author: [deleted] 10 June 2012 01:18:20AM *  1 point [-]

That is a very good explanation for the workings of time, thank you very much for that.

But it doesn't answer my real question. I'll try to be a bit more clear.

Light is always observed at the same speed. I don't think I'm so crazy that I imagined reading this all over the place on the internet. The explanation given for this is that the faster I go, the more I slow down through time, so from my reference frame, light decelerates (or accelerates? I'm not sure, but it actually doesn't matter for my question, so if I'm wrong, just switch them around mentally as you read).

So let's say I'm going in a direction, let's call it "forward". If a ball is going "backward", then from my frame of reference, the ball would appear to go faster than it really is going, because its relative speed = its speed - my speed. This is also true for light, though the deceleration of time apparently counters that effect by making me observe it slower by the precise amount to make it still go at the same speed.

Now take this example again, but instead send the ball forward like me. From my frame of reference, the ball is going slower than it is in reality, again because its relative speed = its speed - my speed. The same would apply to light, but because time has slowed for me, so has the light from my perspective. But wait a second. Something isn't right here. If light has slowed down from my point of view because of the equation "relative speed = its speed - my speed", and time slowing down has also slowed it, then it should appear to be going slower than the speed of light. But it is in fact going precisely at the speed of light! This is a contradiction between the theory as I understand it and reality.

My god, that is probably extremely unclear. The number of times I use the words speed and time and synonyms... I wish I could use visual aids.

Also, I just thought of this, but how does light move through time if it's going at the speed of light? That would give it a velocity of zero in the futureward direction (given the explanation you have linked to), which would be very peculiar.

Anyway, thanks for your time.

Comment author: pragmatist 11 June 2012 05:17:43AM *  2 points [-]

The explanation given for this is that the faster I go, the more I slow down through time, so from my reference frame, light decelerates (or accelerates? I'm not sure, but it actually doesn't matter for my question, so if I'm wrong, just switch them around mentally as you read).

Perhaps I'm reading this wrong, but it seems you're assuming that time slowing down is an absolute, not a relative, effect. Do you think there is an absolute fact of the matter about how fast you're moving? If you do, then this is a big mistake. You only have a velocity relative to some reference frame.

If you don't think of velocity as absolute, what do you mean by statements like this one:

The same would apply to light, but because time has slowed for me, so has the light from my perspective.

There is no absolute fact of the matter about whether time has slowed for you. This is only true from certain perspectives. Crucially, it is not true from your own perspective. From your perspective, time always moves faster for you than it does for someone moving relative to you.

I really encourage you to read the first few chapters of this: http://www.pitt.edu/~jdnorton/teaching/HPS_0410/chapters/index.html

It is simply written and should clear up some of your confusions.