matabele comments on [SEQ RERUN] The Comedy of Behaviorism - Less Wrong

0 Post author: MinibearRex 20 July 2012 04:10AM

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Comment author: TheOtherDave 23 July 2012 07:40:54PM 3 points [-]

The only possible reason appears to be, that these behavioral clues are the only way we have of knowing of ourselves, that we lie.

Wait, what?
On what basis do you infer that this is the only possible reason?

Comment author: matabele 24 July 2012 07:31:37PM *  0 points [-]

On the basis that if one makes definite assertions, responses are more likely :-)

My question: Why is it an evolutionary advantage to betray our lies with behavioural clues? Until challenged with an alternative reason that makes any sense, my assertion remains the only possible reason.

Comment author: TheOtherDave 24 July 2012 09:29:06PM 3 points [-]

Why is it an evolutionary advantage to betray our lies with behavioural clues?

I notice that when mammals hide from predators, or stealthily approach prey, they frequently betray their location and presence. For example, they frequently vibrate the air, radiate heat, and exude various chemicals, which some animals can sense.

To ask why it's an evolutionary advantage to betray our location with such cues is to ask a question so wrong that the attempt to answer it will systematically lead me away from understanding what's going on.

Now, it may be that lying is not analogous; that there really is a selected-for predisposition to be caught out in our lies, as you imply with your question. And if so, asking where that selection pressure comes from is a useful question.

But that's a significant "if."

Comment author: matabele 29 July 2012 07:54:41PM -1 points [-]

... they frequently vibrate the air, radiate heat, and exude various chemicals ...

These signals appear to be unavoidable. When we lie, however, many of our behavioural signals appear to be avoidable: for example.

There is no dispute that we betray our own lies; but why do we betray our lies?

Comment author: VincentYu 24 July 2012 08:10:48PM 0 points [-]

Until challenged with an alternative reason that makes any sense

Those who are unable to lie (e.g., because of involuntary behavioral cues) can credibly signal when they are telling the truth (through a lack of those involuntary cues); those who are good liars have no such credible signal. Related.