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Quantumental comments on Scott Aaronson's cautious optimism for the MWI - Less Wrong
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Comments (70)
Sure I can accept that I might have overestimated how well you should've been able to interpret my post.
Solipsism vs Realism is indeed a metaphor. If you are saying what I think you are saying, then it is quite equivalent.
I do not think that your example of a diagonal line is the same as overlap vs non-overlap at all. In overlap vs non-overlap the ontological differences matter. In a overlapping world, if you are shot, you are guaranteed to survive in another branch, so QI has to be true. In non-overlap, if you get shot, you just die. There is no consciousness that continue on in another branch that it was never connected to...
Also it makes away with the incoherence problem, which is HUGE if you are in the "Born Rule can be derived from decision-theoretic camp".
It is metaphysics, I've already said this in the first post. There is no experiment that can ever distinguish either, just like no experiment can ever tell us if solipsism or realism is true. But obviously (assuming MWI is right) one of them are, only one, not both.
I think 5 of those papers are directly about non-overlap vs overlap, and I can't remember which makes the point best right now, so read any of them you'd like. Or you can read Simon Saunders paper which was in a chapter of the Many Worlds? 2010 book here: http://users.ox.ac.uk/~lina0174/chance.pdf
Ah, I see. "Metaphysics."
By which you mean "taking human morality and decision-making, which evolved in a classical world, and figuring out what decisions you should make in a quantum universe."
Would you agree that overlap vs. non-overlap cannot be answered without looking inside humans, and in fact has little to do with the universe apart from a few postulates of quantum mechanics? For some reason I thought we were talking about the universe.
Anyhow, I think Shane Legg had a nice paper on porting utility functions, though of course humans are inconsistent and you immediately run into problems of how to idealize them. The basic idea being that you split up changes into "new things to care about" and "new ways to express old things." Quantum suicide is probably the easiest thing to deal with via this method.
So you see no objective facts about mwi? non-overlap vs overlap is nonsense in your opinion?
Yes, there are objective facts. Whether a waveunction is made of 2 components or 1 is still not independent of your perspective. No, it's not necessarily nonsense. I am just claiming that the unsolved problems of stuff like "overlap" are not due to a lack of information about quantum mechanics, but due to a lack of information about very complicated things humans do. If it the difficulty of understanding how humans categorize things and revise categories gets attributed to basic quantum mechanics, then we may get some nonsense.
You say there are objective facts, yet you claim it depends on ones perspective...this is contradictory. Have you read any of Wilson's papers? Or Saunders, Lawhead, Ismael etc.? All have written papers clearly indicating the OBJECTIVE difference.
What I am saying is that there are objective facts, but that a wavefunction being two components or one simply happens not to be one of those facts. It's like "is this painting beautiful?" If you look closely enough at one person and make some idealizations, you can say objectively (well, plus idealizations) whether a painting is beautiful for that person, but what is thus beautiful for one person still doesn't have to be beautiful for the next.
On the other hand, if you, say, explained Peano arithmetic to two different people and asked them whether some statement was a theorem or not (and made some idealizations), what is a theorem for one person is a theorem for the next. Or if you asked them to measure the space-time interval between two events. Or if you asked them about the various components of a wavefunction, given a certain basis.