TheOtherDave comments on The noncentral fallacy - the worst argument in the world? - Less Wrong

157 Post author: Yvain 27 August 2012 03:36AM

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Comment author: [deleted] 14 September 2012 08:13:57PM 4 points [-]

You ask for "exist" "true" etc to be tabooed, which is hard. Assuming they even try, it would take a while to wade thru all the philosophical muck and actually get to something, by which point the moment has passed.

Comment author: TheOtherDave 14 September 2012 08:29:54PM 8 points [-]

My usual response to requests for "X exists" to be tabooed is to start talking about reliably predicting future experiences E2 in a range of contexts C (as C approaches infinity) consistent with the past experiences E1 which led me to to put X in my model in the first place. If someone wants to talk about E2 being reliably predictable even though X "doesn't really exist", it's not in the least bit clear to me what they're talking about.

Comment author: DaFranker 14 September 2012 09:12:33PM *  2 points [-]

Thanks! This is a very useful explanation / reduction / taboo.

It also sheds some light and helped me understand quite a bit more, I believe, on this whole "instrumentalism" business some people here seem to really want to protect.

(link is just in case someone misunderstands this as an accusation of "Politics!")

Comment author: TheOtherDave 14 September 2012 09:39:26PM 2 points [-]

You're welcome. I vaguely remember being involved in an earlier discussion that covered this idea at greater length, wherein I described myself as a compatibilist when it comes to instrumentalism, but the obvious google search doesn't find it so perhaps I'm deluded.

Comment author: arundelo 15 September 2012 12:18:34AM 3 points [-]
Comment author: TheOtherDave 15 September 2012 01:23:32AM 0 points [-]

Ayup, that's the one. Thanks!

Comment author: [deleted] 14 September 2012 08:49:27PM 2 points [-]

Yes. I recently described it as this:

the "right" probability distribution is the one that maximizes the expected utility of an expected utility maximizer using that probability distribution.

Comment author: shminux 14 September 2012 08:43:12PM *  0 points [-]

reliably predicting future experiences E2 in a range of contexts C (as C approaches infinity) consistent with the past experiences E1 which led me to to put X in my model in the first place.

I wholeheartedly approve of this approach. If more people used it, we would avoid the recurrent unproductive discussions of QM interpretations, qualia and such.

EDIT. Just to clarify, the part saying "put X in my model" is the essential bit to preempt the discussion of "but does it exist outside your model?", since the latter would violate this definition of "exist". such as this statement by our esteemed Kaj Sotala:

why those beings actually have qualia, and don't merely act like it.

Comment author: TheOtherDave 14 September 2012 08:56:36PM *  0 points [-]

Oh, I very much doubt that. But I'd like to think so.

EDIT: I wrote the above before your edit, and don't really understand your edit.

Comment author: Peterdjones 03 October 2012 10:10:30AM 0 points [-]

Instrumentalism is pretty unproductive when it comes to answering questions about what really exists.