Politics Discussion Thread September 2012

Multiheaded

The last thread didn't fare too badly, I think; let's make it a monthly tradition. (Me, I'm more interested in thinking about real-world policies or philosophies, actual and possible, rather than AI design or physics, and I suspect that many fine, non-mind-killed folks reading LW also are - but might be ashamed to admit it!)

Quoth OrphanWilde:

Top-level comments should introduce arguments; responses should be responses to those arguments.
Upvote and downvote based on whether or not you find an argument convincing in the context in which it was raised. This means if it's a good argument against the argument it is responding to, not whether or not there's a good/obvious counterargument to it; if you have a good counterargument, raise it. If it's a convincing argument, and the counterargument is also convincing, upvote both. If both arguments are unconvincing, downvote both.
A single argument per comment would be ideal; as MixedNuts points out here, it's otherwise hard to distinguish between one good and one bad argument, which makes the upvoting/downvoting difficult to evaluate.
In general try to avoid color politics; try to discuss political issues, rather than political parties, wherever possible.

Let's try to stick to those rules - and maybe make some more if sorely needed.

Oh, and I think that the "Personal is Political" stuff like gender relations, etc also belongs here.

Quoth OrphanWilde:

Top-level comments should introduce arguments; responses should be responses to those arguments.
Upvote and downvote based on whether or not you find an argument convincing in the context in which it was raised. This means if it's a good argument against the argument it is responding to, not whether or not there's a good/obvious counterargument to it; if you have a good counterargument, raise it. If it's a convincing argument, and the counterargument is also convincing, upvote both. If both arguments are unconvincing, downvote both.
A single argument per comment would be ideal; as MixedNuts points out here, it's otherwise hard to distinguish between one good and one bad argument, which makes the upvoting/downvoting difficult to evaluate.
In general try to avoid color politics; try to discuss political issues, rather than political parties, wherever possible.

Let's try to stick to those rules - and maybe make some more if sorely needed.

Oh, and I think that the "Personal is Political" stuff like gender relations, etc also belongs here.

I wasn't saying the "authentic traditionalist Right" could play this game, though the "populist right" obviously can, I was saying that different predators would have evolved in the absence of current ones and that the features of current ones are mostly the result of such pressures rather than being engineered.

You focus too much on the specific and narrow political context. For example the implicit assumptions that this only works in breaking down traditional hierarchies must result in progress for something like the left that has at the very least egalitarian pretences if not perhaps real preferences. To the contrary, I think one of its most adaptive feature is setting up new hierarchies, which may or may not be more egalitarian than the old ones.

I would for example argue the model works quite well if applied to the task mass conversions to different religions or pacification of conquered peoples.

For example the implicit assumptions that this only works in breaking down traditional hierarchies must result in progress for something like the left that has at the very least egalitarian pretences if not perhaps real preferences. To the contrary, I think one of its most adaptive feature is setting up new hierarchies, which may or may not be more egalitarian than the old ones.

Right; it often does. In particular - not a very PC thing to say? - the more generally intelligent and educated a group is, the more the chance that it'll move towards rather tha... (read more)