Peterdjones comments on The raw-experience dogma: Dissolving the “qualia” problem - Less Wrong

2 Post author: metaphysicist 16 September 2012 07:15PM

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Comment author: Peterdjones 14 September 2012 06:05:10PM 0 points [-]

There's no evidence that your programme experiences anything from the inside. Which is one way in which your claim is surreptitiously eliminativist. Another is that, examined from the outside, we can tell what the programme's qualia are: they are nothing. They have no quaities other than being different from one another. But qualia don't seem like that from the inside! You say your programme's qualia are subjective because it can't examine their internal structure...but there ins't any. They are not subjective somethings, they are just nothings.

Comment author: [deleted] 14 September 2012 06:11:39PM 3 points [-]

There's no evidence that your programme experiences anything from the inside.

then neither is there evidence that I do, or you do.

they are nothing. They have no quaities other than being different from one another.

I can't think of qualities that my subjective experience of "red" has that the atom "red" does not have in my program.

But qualia don't seem like that from the inside!

Sure they do. Redness has this unique redness to it the same way "red" has this unique <object at 0x8cf643>ness.

your programme's qualia are subjective because

I was using "subjective" as a perspective, not a quality.

can't examine their internal structure...but there ins't any.

Sure there is. Go look in the lua source code. there is the global string memo-table, GC metadata, string contents (array of bytes), type annotations, etc.

Comment author: Peterdjones 18 September 2012 12:37:16PM 1 point [-]

then neither is there evidence that I do, or you do.

I have plenty of evidence of my own experiences. Were you restricting "evidence" to third-person, objective evidence?

I can't think of qualities that my subjective experience of "red" has that the atom "red" does not have in my program.

I can. I think that if I experienced nothing but an even expanse of red, that would be different from experiencing nothing but a salty taste, or nothing but middle C

Sure they do. Redness has this unique redness to it the same way "red" has this unique <object at 0x8cf643>ness.

Redness isn't expressible. "Object at 0x8cf643" is.

Your programme's qualia are subjective because can't examine their internal structure...but there ins't any.

Sure there is. Go look in the lua source code. there is the global string memo-table, GC metadata, string contents (array of bytes), type annotations, etc

If that's accessible to them, it's objective and expressible. If not, its just a nothing. Neither way do you have a "somethng" that is subjective.

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