kilobug comments on The Useful Idea of Truth - Less Wrong

77 Post author: Eliezer_Yudkowsky 02 October 2012 06:16PM

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Comment author: kilobug 02 October 2012 10:44:13AM 7 points [-]

There's no reason for your brain not to update if politics aren't involved.

I don't agree nor like this singling-out of politics as the only thing in which people don't update. People fail to update in many fields, they'll fail to update in love, in religion, in drug risks, in ... there is almost no domain of life in which people don't fail to update at times, rationalizing instead of updating.

Comment author: TimS 02 October 2012 01:18:24PM 16 points [-]

In addition to what pleeppleep said, I think there is a bit of illusion of transparency here.

As I've said elsewhere, what Eliezer clearly intends with the label "political" is not partisan electioneering to decide whether the community organizer or the business executive is the next President of the United States. Instead, he means something closer to what Paul Graham means when he talks about keeping one's identity small.

Among humans at least, "Personal identity is the mindkiller."

Comment author: fubarobfusco 02 October 2012 11:13:28PM 2 points [-]

what Eliezer clearly intends with the label "political" is [...] something closer to what Paul Graham means when he talks about keeping one's identity small.

This is evidently confusing readers, since over here someone thought it was about "social manipulation, status, and signaling".

Comment author: TimS 03 October 2012 02:18:26AM *  0 points [-]

I must confess that I don't seem any substantial disagreement between my articulation of EY's views and pleeppleep's articulation.

There are certain kinds of inter-personal conflicts that effect a person's mental processes such that the person does not update on the evidence the way rationality says they should. These inter-personal conflicts can profitably labelled with the word "politics." But these inter-personal conflicts include more than those I've labeled "partisan electioneering."

Whether "status-challenge" or "threat-to-personal-identity" is the more accurate description of the causal factors leading to this phenomena is not particularly important to understanding what EY meant when he said "Politics is the mindkiller."

Comment author: [deleted] 02 October 2012 09:07:30PM 0 points [-]

Still, there may be a better word than “politics” for him to use.

Comment author: pleeppleep 02 October 2012 12:47:34PM 1 point [-]

He didn't say "politics" was special. He seemed to be pointing out that updating is called for in circumstances other than the example. "Politics" is used to represent all other issues, and it was relevant because a common criticism of truth is that it is an illusion used to gain a political advantage.