Eugine_Nier comments on 2012 Less Wrong Census/Survey - Less Wrong

65 Post author: Yvain 03 November 2012 11:00PM

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Comment author: gwern 04 November 2012 11:09:12PM *  1 point [-]

There's >170 billion galaxies in the observable universe; you need to make some pretty strong assumptions to overcome a 1:170,000,000,000 difference.

Comment author: Eugine_Nier 05 November 2012 01:24:22AM *  8 points [-]

you need to make some pretty strong assumptions to overcome a 1:170,000,000,000 difference.

Actually you don't. Consider the following highly simplified toy model.

You're not sure where the great filter is but you think there is a 50% chance it's before evolving intelligence (scenario A), and 50% that it's afterward (scenario B).

In scenario A each galaxy only has a 0.1% chance of having intelligent life. (Note that nevertheless the observable universe will still have life somewhere since 0.1% is a lot more than 1/170,000,000,000.)

In scenario B each galaxy has (multiple) planets with intelligent life in it.

Combining these two scenarios gives 100% for life in the universe and 50.1% for life in the galaxy.

By changing these numbers and adding more scenarios you can get different but similar results. You should try this yourself, it's a good way to get an intuition for how Bayesian probabilities work. For example, try adding a scenario C where intelligent life is extremely rare and we exist only due to the anthropic principal. What happens when you assign scenario C 40% and keep scenarios A and B equally likely?

Comment author: gwern 05 November 2012 01:47:52AM 3 points [-]

I'm mentally tired from banging my head against R and can't think through this, so I'm dropping it here.

Comment author: Eugine_Nier 05 November 2012 01:54:57AM 2 points [-]

Feel free to try tomorrow.