Douglas_Knight comments on Survey Results - Less Wrong

48 Post author: Yvain 12 May 2009 10:09PM

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Comment author: SoullessAutomaton 13 May 2009 10:21:49PM *  3 points [-]

But I think that taw is poisoning the discourse, making it worse than it already is. It's a pretty common tactic to paint anyone outside the mainstream as an ideologue.

In what way is he "poisoning" the discourse? He didn't even use the term ideologue, and he explained in a later post why he thinks libertarianism is essentially deontological in nature. Accusing him of "making the discourse worse" only serves to itself worsen the discussion.

Quite frankly, in my experience with people arguing for libertarianism, it tends to be precisely what he describes--a lot of bottom-line faux-consequentialist arguments about why free market principles necessarily produce better results, combined with question-begging arguments that assume individual economic freedom as the value to be maximized.

As a concrete example, by almost any metric European-style socialized health care systems work empirically, objectively better. Given the high cost of trying untested systems and the general lack of predictive power demonstrated by current macroeconomics, I can't conceive of any coherent, consequentialist argument agaisnt the immediate utility of adopting such a system in the USA, yet most libertarians will argue until blue in the face that socialized health care is a terrible idea, in aparent defiance of reality.

EDIT: This comment was pretty promptly voted down to -2 for reasons not apparent to me. Any reasons other than disagreement?

Comment author: Douglas_Knight 14 May 2009 04:58:10AM -1 points [-]

He didn't even use the term ideologue

He used the term "ideology."

Comment author: SoullessAutomaton 14 May 2009 10:31:27AM -1 points [-]

He used the term "ideology."

Are you being disingenuous here, or do you really think those connotationally equivalent?

Comment author: Douglas_Knight 14 May 2009 02:25:23PM -1 points [-]

Some people use ideology more broadly. Others use it exactly as ideologue. It's pretty clear from taw's later comment that he meant it as ideologue. I responded to the short comment rather than the long comment because it merely insinuates.

Comment author: SoullessAutomaton 14 May 2009 10:27:45PM 0 points [-]

It's pretty clear from taw's later comment that he meant it as ideologue.

That does not seem clear to me. Are you certain you aren't reading too much into it?

Assume good faith, as Wikipedia would say.