Desrtopa comments on LW Women Submissions: On Misogyny - Less Wrong

27 [deleted] 10 April 2013 07:54PM

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Comment author: V_V 10 April 2013 11:29:28PM *  22 points [-]

A:

The article about Larsson also has a bit about his partner's contributions not being credited to her, which seems to be typical of man-woman partnerships. Besides seeing it in other stories, I've experienced it in my own life.

Beware of hasty generalization. The fact that you have been in an abusive relationship and you've read similar stories doesn't imply that these relationships are typical.

You might think my ex was a sociopath, but no -- he's a normal male, working as a university professor.

The intersection between the set of sociopaths and the set of university professors is not necessarily empty. However, claiming that this behavior is normal among males is outright sexist defamation. It's like, after sharing a story of being robbed by a black person you said: "You might think my robber was an antisocial person, but no -- they are a normal black person"

B:

I'm not sure what you describe as a body/mind dichotomy really makes sense or is the proper way of describing your experiences. What you describe seems to be known as egodystonicity, which is a quite common phenomenon to a certain extent, but can potentially become pathological.

She has come to regret what she did, but I’m not sure she’s aware of the dynamics behind what happened, including the patriarchal inequity and her brain’s imprecise narrative about making my brother well-behaved.

Receiving abuse doesn't justify committing abuse.

This article, “Being Porn,” refers to women internalizing and enacting men’s porn views, rather than trying to enlighten men so they make better use of resources and don’t become or stay addicted to porn.

That's a patronizing view of male sexuality.
Consider it's reversal: instead of trying to fullfill women preferences (such as preference for high status mates), men should try to enlighten women so they internalize and enact men’s porn views (such as engaging in casual intercourse with random strangers).

For example: On the HLN channel, [ ... ]

Beware of fictional evidence.

creepiness as exclusion or dislike of low-status or unattractive persons [ ... ] Given all my data, I can say approximately that identification of creepiness is a brain making predictions about someone’s brain (could even be one’s own brain, being introspective about whether you’re being creepy) running on a stupid/unenlightened/unwise apologetic program that could possibly escalate into actions unpleasant or of low utility to the target and/or to him/her/one’s self (e.g. energy-wasting, abuse, heartbreak, etc.).

You describe creepiness essentially as a fear response. That's not mutually exclusive of being creeped by of low-status or unattractive persons. In fact, evidence suggests that people tend to instinctively trust attractive and high-status individuals and fear unattractive and low-status individuals.

Comment author: Desrtopa 11 April 2013 12:30:58AM 10 points [-]

The intersection between the set of sociopaths and the set of university professors is not necessarily empty. However, claiming that this behavior is normal among males is outright sexist defamation. It's like, after sharing a story of being robbed by a black person you said: "You might think my robber was an antisocial person, but no -- they are a normal black person"

I also felt while reading this that my sex as a group was being defamed, but while I doubt that the author has the evidence to conclude that such behavior is truly typical of males in general, I also have to be skeptical that my own experiences are sufficient evidence to suppose that such behavior is atypical. Our own social circles tend to be very heavily filtered compared to the overall population, and just because the behavior the author wrote about describes few of the guys I've associated with, doesn't mean it's not normal.

Comment author: NancyLebovitz 11 April 2013 03:28:46AM 7 points [-]

I agree that we don't have evidence that his behavior is typical of men, but I find it plausible that a moderately high proportion of men and women have a script about relationships which makes it easy to maintain such behavior for quite a while without either partner being explicitly aware that it's abusive.

Comment author: V_V 11 April 2013 03:09:11PM *  3 points [-]

That's what statistics are for.

Comment author: NancyLebovitz 11 April 2013 04:23:40PM 2 points [-]

On the other hand, I can't hold it against people that they care about their group reputation.

Comment author: [deleted] 12 April 2013 08:16:54PM 0 points [-]

See also the nice guy privilege.

Comment author: Desrtopa 12 April 2013 10:55:49PM 3 points [-]

It makes a fair point, although I think it's also an illustration of how privilege is a terrible term for the phenomenon it's used to describe.

Comment author: [deleted] 13 April 2013 09:32:58AM *  2 points [-]

In general I agree that “blind spot” (as suggested in the comments to that series of posts) would be a better term, but in this case, I think that being able to joke and display affection without people freaking out is a privilege even in the ordinary colloquial sense of the word.

Comment author: NancyLebovitz 13 April 2013 12:53:56PM 0 points [-]

Thanks for the link-- I'd missed a bunch of the comments, including Ragen Chastain explaining why (though she won't criticize other people for using "privilege", she doesn't use it herself.