Qiaochu_Yuan comments on Politics Discussion Thread January 2013 - Less Wrong

6 Post author: OrphanWilde 02 January 2013 03:31AM

You are viewing a comment permalink. View the original post to see all comments and the full post content.

Article Navigation

Comments (334)
Tags: politics thread

Comments (334)

You are viewing a single comment's thread. Show more comments above.

Comment author: Spectral_Dragon 20 January 2013 02:27:37AM 0 points [-]

I'm curious about the general stance towards alcohol, from Lesswrong. It (1) lowers the quality of life, and life expectancy (3rd highest cause of preventable death in the US), for almost all people drinking, or closely linked to people who drink, (2) costs a fair bit (The money spent per year in europe on alcohol-related damages could fund a manned mission to mars), (3) and offers little to no positive effects (Only proven short-term effects are temporary loss of motor control and some brain functions like balance and memory, anything else seems to be a placebo).

So, I'd like to know if you're for or against limiting alcohol (through laws lowering sales, altering public opinion etc.) and why.

Submitting...

Comment author: Qiaochu_Yuan 20 January 2013 07:15:43AM *  7 points [-]

That "offers little to no positive effects" comment suggests to me that you have limited personal experience with alcohol. The primary benefit I (and I think most drinkers my age) derive from alcohol is social: it helps me make new friends and connect more closely to existing friends. Lots of people drink, and it's easier to become friends with those people if you also drink. If that isn't enough LW lingo for you, drinking is a Schelling point.

Also, what do people have against placebo effects? Quoting myself seems dangerously egotistical, but "a placebo effect is still an effect." Maybe someone should write a top-level post about this.

Comment author: Spectral_Dragon 20 January 2013 06:51:18PM 0 points [-]

I've had enough experience to compare interactions with and without alcohol, and I've noticed it's much more difficult to connect with anyone who's been drinking, even if I've also been. Merely personal, but with no alcohol in my regular life, I still gain friends easily, now having gained far above my Dunbar's Number. Have you tested if it actually is more difficult if all parties are sober?

I'm against this particular one, since as a placebo, something lacking the negative effects while achieving the positive placebo effects would be much more awesome.

Comment author: Qiaochu_Yuan 21 January 2013 04:51:31AM 1 point [-]

Doesn't agree with my experience. I generally find that people are more relaxed and open when not sober.

I am also generally skeptical of arguments of the form "if we counterfactually modified aspect X of the world to aspect Y, the world would be more awesome, therefore we should start trying to change X into Y" because they ignore transition costs. (A simple example is X = imperial units and Y = metric in the US.) The world would probably be a better place if the social role of alcohol was replaced by a less destructive drug, but I don't think it's feasible to actually force such a replacement to occur, or at least I don't think it's a good use of political resources.

Powered by Reddit Powered by Reddit