John_Maxwell_IV comments on Least Signaling Activities? - Less Wrong

27 Post author: RobinHanson 22 May 2009 02:46AM

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Comment author: Liron 22 May 2009 06:23:15AM 0 points [-]

Taking a walk alone in the hills because you enjoy the scenery.

Comment author: John_Maxwell_IV 22 May 2009 07:49:41PM *  1 point [-]

Be careful. I was once in a class where we played two truths and a lie to get to know each other. There was another fellow who had "I have survived by myself five days in the wilderness" as one of his truths. He got big props from the girls.

Do you suppose he went into the wilderness with the express purpose of impressing girls? I doubt it. He was probably more interested in the scenery.

Comment author: gwern 23 May 2009 05:48:16PM 1 point [-]

Do you suppose he went into the wilderness with the express purpose of impressing girls? I doubt it. He was probably more interested in the scenery.

If I understand Hanson's thread of thought, signaling doesn't need to be 'express'. Given the value of self-deception, signaling might well be better off hiding itself from consciousness.

And even so, signaling gives information. If I pick my nose in public, I'm sending powerful signals to the people around me - both about my hygiene and my social adeptness - but am I expressly thinking about those consequences? I'm more likely to be thinking 'Aah, that's better!'

Comment author: John_Maxwell_IV 24 May 2009 12:06:23AM 1 point [-]

Given the value of self-deception, signaling might well be better off hiding itself from consciousness.

Right, that was my point. Even the things that don't seem to be about signaling could be about signaling.

Comment author: Z_M_Davis 24 May 2009 01:00:19AM 1 point [-]

It depends on what you mean by about---beware teleological capture. Suppose that your contemporary really, really likes scenery, and also, separately, furthermore, likes to brag about the time he spent in the wilderness to observe the scenery. In describing your contemporary's behavior, we can simply note these two separate facts, without making any potentially confusing assertions about what the behavior is really "about."