= 27d567bc2d48d9f40e9ccc20ea370b15)
TheOtherDave comments on Changing Systems is Different than Running Controlled Experiments - Don’t Choose How to Run Your Country That Way! - Less Wrong
You are viewing a comment permalink. View the original post to see all comments and the full post content.
= 783df68a0f980790206b9ea87794c5b6)
Loading…= b715d02e85f7b3b4ae65ca3d3e450868)
Subscribe to RSS Feed
= f037147d6e6c911a85753b9abdedda8d){kind=logo}
Comments (260)
WRT understanding vs wishful thinking... fair enough.
As I said initially, I'm talking primarily about the feminists/social justice activists I know; I'm pretty confident that I understand what they mean, having discussed the issue at some length with many of them, but of course that's no reason for you to be confident, especially if you don't consider me a source of reliable reports. There's also no particular reason, even if you do consider me reliable, for you to consider them representative of other communities.
WRT steelmanning... I'm not sure I follow.
Are you suggesting that, supposing hypothetically that what is meant by "there is no female privilege" really is "aggregating across all scenarios, males have a higher privilege score than females", it is nevertheless a good thing to behave as though what was meant was "there are no scenarios under which females have benefits over non-females"?
I meant: If a person says <something stupid>, and you say "oh, you probably meant <something smart but sounding similar>", you gave them an opportunity to save face. When you do this to a group of people, you give them an opportunity to switch to the smart opinion without feeling like betraying their tribe. And if only a part of the group changes their mind, without this option they would probably leave the group, but with this option they can stay and perhaps the smart opinion will some day really become the official version.
Sure, I understand the general case. It's the specific case I'm being confused by. What is the stupid statement being made, and what is the similar-sounding smart statement you're endorsing using instead?
The stupid thing is "there is no female privilege". The smart thing is your steelman of it, "aggregating across all scenarios, males have a higher privilege score than females".
I would be surprised if that's what ViliamBur meant, but I have no objection to the statement, modulo emotional connotations.
Actually, I did mean exactly that.
The difference between "men have more advantages than women" which I guess is true, and "women have absolutely no advantage, ever" which seems to me obviously false, but is how I would naturally unpack "there is no female privilege".
Ah, OK. (I am, in fact, surprised.) Thanks for clarifying.