Qiaochu_Yuan comments on Harry Potter and the Methods of Rationality discussion thread, part 19, chapter 88-89 - Less Wrong

12 Post author: Vaniver 30 June 2013 01:22AM

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Comment author: loserthree 30 June 2013 08:50:40PM *  23 points [-]

I predict that it will be revealed that Quirrell or a closely related entity has been abusing Harry on and off throughout his life, to try and make him into a Dark Lord.

He can go to Harry's house like the time he played Father Christmas.

Obliviated memories leave residue, which is how in Chapter 88 the twins remembered that they could find people, in the castle, but couldn't remember how.

In the first chapter, Harry noticed that he believed in magic.

some part of Harry was utterly convinced that magic was real

In chapter 16, Harry is almost reminded of something when he looks at Quirell, but can't remember what. And when Quirrell is first introduced, Harry ominously recognizes him

"Professor?" Harry said, once they were in the courtyard. He had meant to ask what was going on, but oddly found himself asking an entirely different question instead. "Who was that pale man, by the corner? The man with the twitching eye?"

"Hm?" said Professor McGonagall, sounding a bit surprised; perhaps she hadn't expected that question either. "That was Professor Quirinus Quirrell. He'll be teaching Defence Against the Dark Arts this year at Hogwarts."

"I had the strangest feeling that I knew him..." Harry rubbed his forehead. "And that I shouldn't ought to shake his hand." Like meeting someone who had been a friend, once, before something went drastically wrong... that wasn't really it at all, but Harry couldn't find words.

In the sixth chapter, McGonagall points out that Harry can act like an abused child.

sometimes, you say or do something that seems very much like... someone who spent his first eleven years locked in a cellar.

Quirrell uses Obliviation and memory charms and as Mr. Cloak-and-Hat, he manipulated Blaise. And he uses Obliviation and memory charms more subtly, to change someone's mood and personality over time, as shown when he brute-force-save-scumed his way to making Hermione suspicious of Draco.

Quirrell expected Harry to become a Dark Lord when he spoke with him after the first class and was surprised that Harry aspired to science.

Quirrell expects the worst out of people, and so he expected that an abused Harry would be destined to darkness.

Edit: I just realized that Harry was probably abused almost every night (or day) for some significant period. There was a time turner involved, and that's why his sleep cycle is off.

Comment author: Qiaochu_Yuan 30 June 2013 09:51:21PM *  11 points [-]

My interpretation is that all of these are symptoms of Harry's dark side (which is the backup copy / horcrux of Voldemort somewhere in him).

There was a time turner involved, and that's why his sleep cycle is off.

This is an intriguing hypothesis, but are you aware that Eliezer also has this condition? I was under the impression that he was working off of his own experiences here and nothing more.

Comment author: elharo 01 July 2013 10:53:48AM *  10 points [-]

I think the simpler "conscious Horcrux inside Harry" theories are ruled out by the sorting hat: "I can tell you that there is definitely nothing like a ghost - mind, intelligence, memory, personality, or feelings - in your scar. Otherwise it would be participating in this conversation, being under my brim."

It is possible that the original, canon Harry has been completely replaced by Voldemort, or that the Horcrux has merged with Harry to form a new single personality. The sorting hat is also explicit that it does not remember previous students such as Tom Riddle as individuals. Therefore it would not notice if HJPEV were in fact Tom Riddle redux. However there's just one person in Harry, not two.

Comment author: robryk 01 July 2013 10:27:36PM 2 points [-]

The hat talked specifically about objects under its brim. Maybe the horcrux is in some other part of Harry?

Comment author: loserthree 30 June 2013 10:04:04PM *  2 points [-]

This is an intriguing hypothesis, but are you aware that Eliezer also has this condition? I was under the impression that he was working off of his own experiences here and nothing more.

I probably heard that at some point; it's been years since this started, now. But I expect better of him than "I get ingrown toenails and ingrown toenails don't get enough attention from the public so I'm going to give my protagonist that problem, too."

Also, cannon Harry didn't have the sleep cycle problem. For the most part, there are in-universe reasons for departures from cannon other than, "That was dumb and I'm not writing a story with dumb in it."

Comment author: MugaSofer 29 July 2013 07:55:07PM *  0 points [-]

This is an intriguing hypothesis, but are you aware that Eliezer also has this condition?

Really? I hadn't heard that. Where did you see that? Could you link to it?

Comment author: Qiaochu_Yuan 29 July 2013 11:28:14PM 1 point [-]

I talked to him and he told me.

Comment author: MugaSofer 31 July 2013 02:18:36PM -1 points [-]

Huh, there's a thing. I guess he just never mentioned it online.

Comment author: arundelo 31 July 2013 04:42:08PM *  1 point [-]

I think I remember seeing him mention it somewhere online but I failed to find it within a few minutes of searching.

Edit: See also:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Non-24-hour_sleep-wake_disorder
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Circadian_rhythm_sleep_disorder#Normal_circadian_rhythms

Edit 2: In the August 27 2013 HP: MoR author's note Eliezer says that he has non-24 sleep disorder (but that he recently fixed it with help from MetaMed).