Randaly comments on Harry Potter and the Methods of Rationality discussion thread, part 20, chapter 90 - Less Wrong

9 Post author: palladias 02 July 2013 02:13AM

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Comment author: gwern 02 July 2013 02:35:58AM 10 points [-]

Does this describe an event that has already happened?

It's been debated constantly since the start because it's highlighted as important. The best guess was that it might have been when Voldemort attacked the Potters, but there's obvious problems with that (what's the silver? and as far as we know, no blood was shed by Voldemort since he favored AKs). Given that ch90 brings up blood as a powerful sacrificial element, it's looking more like it's about a future event and maybe a ritual by Harry - pursuant to bringing back Hermione being the obvious goal.

Comment author: Randaly 02 July 2013 04:28:17AM *  4 points [-]

what's the silver?

The only plot-significant things that have been described as silver are Fawkes, the Time-Turner, Dumbledore's beard, Lucius Malfoy's cane, and Patronus charms. I think we can safely eliminate Dumbledore's beard and Malfoy's cane. If it is in the future, I would have dismissed the time-turner before the past 2 chapters, but not anymore.

(I still believe it likely describes the attack on the Potters. Edit: I no longer believe this.)

Comment author: JTHM 02 July 2013 04:32:14AM *  14 points [-]

"Beneath the moonlight glints a tiny fragment of silver, a fraction of a line..."

This sounds like an alchemy circle, which has to be drawn "to the fineness of a child's hair." I guess it involves the creation of a philosopher's stone.

Comment author: fubarobfusco 02 July 2013 05:34:34AM 1 point [-]

Or a horcrux? We still don't know what the ritual for that looks like.

Comment author: elharo 02 July 2013 10:39:33AM 2 points [-]

We know from canon and Word of Rowling that it involves murder, and is so disgusting it almost made her editor vomit.

Comment author: NancyLebovitz 02 July 2013 01:03:09PM 8 points [-]

Nitpick: "felt like vomiting" is well short of being almost made to vomit.

Comment author: tondwalkar 04 July 2013 03:17:17AM 1 point [-]

And if Yudkowsky's going to make a Fullmetal Alchemist reference, we know how to make a philosopher's stone, or even crude approximations, but only using human scarifice.

Comment author: hairyfigment 02 July 2013 08:48:18AM -1 points [-]

Could be alchemy or related magic used to turn someone's blood into a fake burned body. (Free transmutation seems easy to recognize.) But I've been thinking of it as an event in the past, which now seems dubious.

Comment author: Benito 02 July 2013 07:29:09AM *  8 points [-]

In the first Canon, unicorn's blood is silver, and that has a life-extension effect.

IIRC, Canon!Dumbledore says it is used as a last, terrible resort of a wretched life (or something).

Comment author: ikrase 02 July 2013 08:40:49AM 2 points [-]

In canon, it's also Unicorn blood.

It could also be Harry using Godric Gryffindor's sword to murder someone (Bellatrix?) in order to power the Summon Death ritual.

Comment author: Alsadius 02 July 2013 05:39:56PM 5 points [-]

I've always interpreted the Summon Death ritual to just create a dementor.

Comment author: Ritalin 02 July 2013 07:00:35PM 2 points [-]

That is completely out of character.

Comment author: Alsadius 03 July 2013 03:34:34AM 3 points [-]

Remember his anti-Batman resolution from a few chapters ago, where he said that a dead body means the gloves come off and he quits trying to fight a bloodless war.

Comment author: NihilCredo 04 July 2013 03:30:26AM 1 point [-]

Eliezer edited out his explicit resolution at some point before these updates began.

Comment author: Alsadius 04 July 2013 03:46:32AM *  2 points [-]

Noted. I think it's still a fairly accurate summary of his mental state, however.

Edit: Half of Ch. 85 is still basically in this vein.

Harry closed his eyes, swallowing hard a few times against the sudden choking sensation. It was abruptly very clear that while Harry was going around trying to live the ideals of the Enlightenment, Dumbledore was the one who'd actually fought in a war. Nonviolent ideals were cheap to hold if you were a scientist, living inside the Protego bubble cast by the police officers and soldiers whose actions you had the luxury to question. Albus Dumbledore seemed to have started out with ideals at least as strong as Harry's own, if not stronger; and Dumbledore hadn't gotten through his war without killing enemies and sacrificing friends.

Are you so much better than Haukelid and Dumbledore, Harry Potter, that you'll be able to fight without a single casualty? Even in the world of comic books, the only reason a superhero like Batman even looks successful is that the comic-book readers only notice when Important Named Characters die, not when the Joker shoots some random nameless bystander to show off his villainy. Batman is a murderer no less than the Joker, for all the lives the Joker took that Batman could've saved by killing him. That's what the man named Alastor was trying to tell Dumbledore, and afterward Dumbledore regretted having taken so long to change his mind. Are you really going to try to follow the path of the superhero, and never sacrifice a single piece or kill a single enemy?

Comment author: ikrase 02 July 2013 09:55:32PM 1 point [-]

<badass voice> Not anymore. </badass voice>.

Or he could just go all brutalist utilitarian.

Comment author: Mestroyer 03 July 2013 03:39:16AM 3 points [-]

You mean like this?

Comment author: ikrase 03 July 2013 04:34:11AM 1 point [-]

Ooops. No. I mean more like Grindelvaldesque.

Comment author: Fermatastheorem 02 July 2013 05:52:33PM 0 points [-]

Would Harry have access to the sword, being a Ravenclaw?

Comment author: linkhyrule5 02 July 2013 06:04:27AM 0 points [-]

It could just be a random knife.

Comment author: Randaly 02 July 2013 06:17:55AM 2 points [-]

Possible, but unlikely.

Comment author: Velorien 02 July 2013 12:14:18PM 4 points [-]

The detail given could be that a knife is being used rather than a wand. And no-one we know would use a knife to kill rather than a wand unless there was a very special reason to do so.

Comment author: Decius 02 July 2013 09:28:43PM 0 points [-]

Unless they can't do magic...