Eliezer_Yudkowsky comments on Harry Potter and the Methods of Rationality discussion thread, part 27, chapter 98 - Less Wrong

2 Post author: Vaniver 28 August 2013 07:29PM

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Comment author: JoshuaZ 29 August 2013 01:56:24PM 2 points [-]

That he would fall into that category seems doubtful given that he's been exposed to so much science fiction though. Cryonics is a staple of scifi, so it shouldn't take him that much thinking to see how plausible it could be or to note that people have actually tried it.

Comment author: Eliezer_Yudkowsky 29 August 2013 05:22:46PM 4 points [-]

SF readers don't know either.

Comment author: roystgnr 29 August 2013 10:45:29PM 3 points [-]

What if we narrow it down to "Niven readers"? "Corpsicles" feature in a Niven-verse novel and a novella from the 70s, and Harry makes an offhand reference to Niven-verse Puppeteers in HPMOR chapter 9. Harry might not know about Alcor but he should at least be aware of the general idea.

Comment author: JoshuaZ 29 August 2013 10:05:13PM *  1 point [-]

This claim is surprising. The Psychomech trilogy (published in the mid 1980s) involves deliberate cryonic preservation of multiple characters in the hope that when one of them becomes a functional god he'll be able to resurrect them. In that case, one of the characters who is preserved is the love-interest of the protagonist. And the later books in that series imagine a world in a not too distant future where cryonics is extremely common. Lem's "Fiasco" deals with medical cryonics and is also from the 1980s. Pohl's "The Age of Pussyfoot" also has explicit medical cryonics, albeit with a somewhat reactionary message.

Ettinger himself was inspired to think about cryonics as a practical thing from the short story "The Jameson Satellite" (admittedly fairly obscure).

As a matter of pure anecdote, I had encountered the idea in multiple contexts when I was about Harry's age, and Harry if anything has been exposed to more scifi than I had at that age.

Comment author: NancyLebovitz 30 August 2013 01:52:44PM 0 points [-]

On the other hand, I'd never heard of Psychomech, and I thought I knew sf from that era fairly well. Perhaps the book is better known in the UK.

Comment author: LucasSloan 29 August 2013 05:52:17PM 1 point [-]

Does your theory have anything more to say than "the internet has changed things" to explain why I knew about cryonics at Harry's age?

Comment author: Eliezer_Yudkowsky 30 August 2013 08:05:10AM 3 points [-]

...not especially? I heard about when I read "Great Mambo Chicken and the Transhuman Condition", memory says at age 11 but the book's publication date might imply I should have been 12. "The Internet has changed things" - yes it did.

Comment author: Izeinwinter 29 August 2013 06:18:54PM 5 points [-]

Harry is very, very likely to have come across the concept of cold sleep. That is not cryonics. Cryonics is the idea of freezing the dead in the hope of fixing the problem later with better tech, even if you do not even know how to revive the frozen at the time. As a serious idea, it is new and fringy, as fiction.. It does come up, but not very often - even people wishing to throw a character into the future usually handwave a stasis field.

Comment author: LucasSloan 29 August 2013 08:45:00PM 1 point [-]

Sure. That still doesn't answer the question of who does hear about it. We could just say that 1% of people who read SF have heard about it, but then my experience is hard to explain - I hadn't read all that much SF by age 11. It seems quite reasonable to say that the 10 years that the Internet existed between me and Harry was decisive, but I'm asking what variables explain the difference between two SF readers, only one of whom has heard of cryonics.

Comment author: Izeinwinter 30 August 2013 03:45:55AM 2 points [-]

Uhm - an personal experience like this holds approximately zero data about its own frequency. The sheer number of things you encounter and learn about while growing up, and the universe of learning are both so vast that if your exploration of the library strays from the beaten path of school assignments, bestsellers and nigh-compulsory classics at all, you will learn many, many things which only small minorities have also encountered.

Comment author: hairyfigment 29 August 2013 09:16:22PM -1 points [-]

Well, how did you hear about it? I didn't (or didn't see it as a real possibility) until I read a mostly non-fiction book by Robert Anton Wilson, long after the age of 11.

Comment author: LucasSloan 29 August 2013 11:45:47PM 1 point [-]

I can't recall at this distance.