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private_messaging comments on Notes on Brainwashing & 'Cults' - Less Wrong
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I would estimate 66% or so, on the basis that a multitude of experiments found that about 2/3 of people are considerably more susceptible to authority than the rest, but I am not sure to which extent they managed to kill off the 1/3 , or to which extent the 1/3's conditional compliance counts towards "successfully brainwashed". edit: ahh, you say founding dictator. Well, then it could easily be higher, because it's a much less practical thing to think rebellious thoughts about right now.
It would seem that one could replace "2/3" with any other proper fraction and that finding would remain true.
Editing the quote to remove the "considerably" changes the meaning. The original is not a tautology because the "considerably" suggests a visible step in the curve.
I didn't remove a word. The original was edited to change the meaning.
Yea, you merely interpreted it in a ridiculous way that was not intended, thus requiring an extra word where none would have been needed if maxim of relevance at all held.
Your edited version is far more useful. Thankyou.
My apologies then. It would be useful if LessWrong marked edited posts as edited.
It does mark edited comments, by an * after the date. It does not mark edits to top-level posts or edits by admins (even self-edits by admins, which is clearly a bug).
Thanks, I didn't notice the '*'s.
private_messaging's post is edited. I bet wedrifid quoted it as it originally was, and private_messaging edited it later to change the meaning. Edit2: (To change my posts's meaning, heh) or to clarify the original intended meaning.
Edit: fixed formatting error caused by not escaping the underscore private_messaging's name.
If there a visible step in the curve that would be interesting. If anyone has any sources that makes such a claim, please provide it.
Well, it still seems odd that with different set ups of e.g. Milgram experiment, various conformity experiments, and such, around 2/3 is the number rather than some dramatically different fraction (which suggests that in practice the change in susceptibility is greater around that percentile, which is of course what I meant). There really is no data to use to get any sort of specific number for North Korea, at all, but if you have to guess you have to name something. I'd be cautious of over-estimating the power of brainwashing over there. Especially considering how many people they did have to put through prison camps and such.
Depending on the specifics which get used during the Milgram experiment you get different results. It matters whether the person being tortured is in the same room. Whether or not you use a setting that gives you 2/3 of the people is arbitary.