Kaj_Sotala comments on Why I haven't signed up for cryonics - Less Wrong

29 Post author: Swimmer963 12 January 2014 05:16AM

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Comment author: Kaj_Sotala 15 January 2014 06:30:47PM 2 points [-]

"If everyone decided to dedicate their lives to altruism while accepting full misery to themselves, then everyone would be miserable, therefore total altruism is an incoherent value insofar as you expect anyone (including yourself) to ever actually follow it to its logical conclusion, therefore you shouldn't follow it in the first place."

Sorry, I don't follow. If the logical result of accepting full misery to oneself would be everyone being miserable, why wouldn't the altruists just reason this out and not accept full misery to themselves? "Valuing everyone the same as yourself" doesn't mean you'd have to let others treat you any way they like, it just means you'd in principle be ready for it, if it was necessary.

(I think we're just debating semantics rather than disagreeing now, do you agree?)

Comment author: [deleted] 15 January 2014 06:37:41PM *  2 points [-]

I think we have slightly different values, but are coming to identical practical conclusions, so we're agreeing violently.

EDIT: Besides, I totally get warm fuzzies from being nice to people, so it's not like I don't have a "selfish" motivation towards a higher level of altruism, anyway. SWEAR I'M NOT EVIL.

Comment author: Kaj_Sotala 16 January 2014 06:49:53AM 1 point [-]

You said you'd prefer everyone to live awesome lives, I'm not sure how that could be construed as evil. :)

Comment author: [deleted] 16 January 2014 07:38:33AM 1 point [-]

Serious answer: Even if I don't endorse it, I do feel a pang of guilt/envy/low-status at being less than 100% a self-impoverishing Effective Altruist, which has been coming out as an urge to declare myself not-evil, even by comparison.

Joke answer: eyes flash white, sips tea. SOON.

Comment author: Kaj_Sotala 16 January 2014 08:45:40AM *  2 points [-]

Okay, in that case you should stop feeling those negative emotions right now. :) Nobody here is a 100% self-impoverishing EA, and we ended up agreeing that it wouldn't even be a useful goal to have, so go indulge yourself in something not-at-all-useful-nor-altruistic and do feel good about it. :)

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