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tedks comments on Using vs. evaluating (or, Why I don't come around here no more) - Less Wrong
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Comments (38)
Then why are you on less wrong? Have you read the sequences?
I'm genuinely perplexed at why someone would spend as much time on LW as you seem to have done while never using any of the ideas in its meme pool. The stated point of this site is to improve human rationality. That means you.
Do you think you're already above what LW could have taught you? Do you think LW is entirely wrong and just like to tell people that? What's the deal?
I'm attracted to LW because the idea of a group of people collectively becoming stronger is a powerful one. It's not the reality of LW, but I'm willing to stick around and scan it every one in a while for someone I can use, and when I see someone I can use, I try to use it. I feel that using ideas I've found on LW has made me much better at the things I do.
The "stated point" is not very relevant to the personal utility one can find.
"...the street finds its own uses for things" -- William Gibson.
Can you give an example of great personal utility being conveyed by using a self-help website for some other purpose?
I guess this goes back to the OPs point that less wrong is more about arguing about minutia than anything else.
I derive noninstrumental value from thinking about decision-making in new and different ways. For example, I don't know if it's useful exactly to sharpen my ideas about ethics, but it's stimulating and pleasant.
A number of contributors here are good writers, and I enjoy reading their work. I particularly enjoy reading prose from Eliezer and Scott, even if it doesn't help me in any direct way.
Sure. One whitehat example: LW is a community of highly intelligent weird people. I am sure some find a lot of personal utility in just being members of such a community.
And one blackhat example: LW people are a good target for trolling and successful trolling leads to hilarious lulz.
This goes right back to the OP's point: more people "use" LW for status contests than they do for self-improvement.
So, if the OP posts something on LW, it's going to be mined for pitfalls to be exploited and pointed out in order to gain status, rather than being fairly evaluated as an instrumental tool.
Which is why the OP doesn't like LW any more. And why LW will trend towards uselessness over time.
Gaining utility from being a member of a community is NOT AT ALL the same as using that community for status contests.