Vaniver comments on White Lies - Less Wrong

38 Post author: ChrisHallquist 08 February 2014 01:20AM

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Comment author: Vaniver 10 February 2014 09:42:46PM 5 points [-]

the title has now been changed to "White Lies", which I've never heard used conversationally to cover things like "no, Mom, not gay".

I have always interpreted "white lies" as "lies I approve of" rather than "small lies," because the size of a lie is clearly a subjective measurement. It looks like wiki mostly agrees.

Comment author: blacktrance 10 February 2014 09:51:04PM *  4 points [-]

"Lies I approve of" and "white lies" are overlapping sets, but aren't quite the same. For example, if a Nazi asks you if you're hiding any Jews (and you are), I approve of lying to them, but this isn't a white lie. On the other hand, if your horrible racist aunt asks you if she's racist, telling her that she's not would be a white lie, but not one that I approve of.

Comment author: Vaniver 10 February 2014 10:05:36PM 2 points [-]

Looking at Augustine's taxonomy the terminology seems clearer, as it differentiates "lies told to please others in smooth discourse," which is what I think Alicorn would associate with 'white lies,' with "lies that harm no one and that protect someone from bodily defilement." (And note how the lies in religious teachings mirrors the discussion of lies in science!) As expected, Augustine thinks it's better to lie to the Nazi than to lie to your aunt.

But again it seems the subjectivity shines through in the definition of harm, if you want to put the hidden Jew lie in Augustine's last category. Isn't the Nazi harmed when you lie to him, and he doesn't get to catch the hidden Jew?

Comment author: drethelin 10 February 2014 10:48:01PM 6 points [-]

most people WANT the nazi to be harmed.

Comment author: Vaniver 11 February 2014 01:30:33AM 2 points [-]

Indeed.

Comment author: blacktrance 10 February 2014 10:09:04PM -2 points [-]

Isn't the Nazi harmed when you lie to him, and he doesn't get to catch the hidden Jew?

I would argue that the Nazi isn't really harmed when you lie to him, because not having a preference satisfied is not necessarily harm.

Comment author: Eugine_Nier 11 February 2014 03:37:52AM *  -2 points [-]

On the other hand, if your horrible racist aunt asks you if she's racist

The problem with that example is that "racist" as commonly used has several very different meanings and political forces that intentionally try to confuse them.