SaidAchmiz comments on Rationality Quotes March 2014 - Less Wrong

4 Post author: malcolmocean 01 March 2014 03:34PM

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Comment author: JQuinton 13 March 2014 05:00:56PM *  2 points [-]

I admit, I get horribly mind-killed whenever I realize I'm reading something by CS Lewis, especially anything from The Screwtape Letters. That's because years ago, the arguments in this book were used against me by a girl I was dating as a means to end our relationship (me being non-religious), who herself was convinced by her friends and family that we should break up.

That said, I was able to read this and appreciate it more clearly if I substituted the quote like so:

Jargon, not argument, is your best ally in keeping him from the [bad guys]. Don’t waste time trying to make him think that [good guys' philosophy] is true! Make him think it is strong, or stark, or courageous— that it is the philosophy of the future. That’s the sort of thing he cares about.

If we are attempting to spread good rationality around, would it be efficient to not try to convince people that rationality was "true", but instead attempt to promote good rationality by saying that rationality is "strong, stark, or courageous -- that it is the philosophy of the future"?

Comment author: SaidAchmiz 13 March 2014 06:30:25PM *  4 points [-]

So you propose to spread rationality by encouraging irrationality?

Even assuming that this will work — that is, not just get people to buy into rationality (that part is simple) but actually become more rational, after this initial dose of irrational motivation — what do you suggest we do when our new recruits turn around and go "Hey, wait a tick; you guys got me into this through blatantly irrational arguments! You cynically and self-servingly pandered to my previously-held biases to get me on your side! You tricked me, you bastards!"? Grin and say "worked, didn't it"?

Comment author: JQuinton 13 March 2014 09:28:31PM -2 points [-]

So you propose to spread rationality by encouraging irrationality?

That seems to be what the quote is arguing.

Comment author: ArisKatsaris 13 March 2014 09:52:07PM 8 points [-]

The quote is spoken by a devil, who's deliberately seeking to destroy and devour a person...

Comment author: RolfAndreassen 15 March 2014 09:54:07PM 3 points [-]

The speaker does not himself believe that materialism is true; he is giving advice on how to make another believe a falsehood.

Comment author: SaidAchmiz 13 March 2014 10:37:51PM 1 point [-]

And do you think it's a good idea?